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Lock Washers different sizes?


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  #1  
Old 11-06-2018, 03:40:21 PM
uglyblue66 uglyblue66 is offline
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Default Lock Washers different sizes?

On my Choremaster project I ran into this. The stock lock washers were smaller outer diameter than the ones we can buy at the hardware. I need a few,both 5/16ths and 1/4 to make this project more correct. If you look at the bottom "capscrew" you will see the washer is hidden, the top one is showing the new type washer.
Any else run into this? I had no idea where to put this thread.
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Old 11-06-2018, 03:58:23 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Unhappy Re: lock washers different sizes?

I have run into it too. It is a real pain trying to get the 'new' washers into a small recessed hole. I most recently ran into this on a Jacobsen Twin engine. The washers that were for the shroud mounts were either missing or broken. The shroud work mounts with machine screws, and the ones behind the flywheel are recessed into the shroud work. it took a lot of time with a super fine grind wheel and a home made set up to hold the washers, in order to trim them down to fit. WHAT a PITA!
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Old 11-06-2018, 04:45:31 PM
Pat Barrett Pat Barrett is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Hard for me to tell, with my computer, but looks like you need some "HI Collar Lock Washers. Is that a Socket Head Cap Screw. I have some of those here, at my work, if you only need a few.
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Old 11-06-2018, 04:47:35 PM
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grub54891 grub54891 is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Sometimes* I will find a washer of the next size down will fit better. Depends wich discount house they get their hardware from at the next order.
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Old 11-06-2018, 04:54:52 PM
uglyblue66 uglyblue66 is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Yes I am fairly certian they are called cap screws
I could use 6 1/4 and 4 5/16ths to make the project a bit more correct.
I like the grinder idea though.I thought about it but I have had stuff to sling from here half way to china before that is really small when i try to grind it if this small.
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Old 11-06-2018, 05:25:41 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Talking Re: lock washers different sizes?

Similar problem to what I has with the Jacobsen. I put 8 washers on a long screw, and cranked on 2 nuts until the washers wre collapsed (split type washers) I then ground down the excess to match the head of the screw. That got me 6 usable washers (I didn't want to grind down the nuts). Worked for me! By the way, the screws were 8-32s
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Old 11-06-2018, 05:45:43 PM
len k len k is online now
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Could always use some locktite instead of lock washer
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Old 11-06-2018, 05:48:42 PM
Power Power is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

most lock washers are spring steel. Grinding on them weakens them, sets up stress risers, and can remove temper.
You could use a regular washer of correct size and locktite or similar thread locker.
There have been discussions on this forum as to the value of lock washers, along with vibration demonstrations. It appears they have little locking value.
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Old 11-06-2018, 05:53:00 PM
Pat Barrett Pat Barrett is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Ugly Blue, send me your address and I'll get you 6 and 4 and mail to you.
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Old 11-06-2018, 07:59:17 PM
JoeCB JoeCB is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Maybe try various size metric lock washers, they generally have thinner wall thickness. You may get lucky and find a size that fits the screw you are using.

Joe B
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Old 11-06-2018, 08:21:09 PM
Bob Krummel Bob Krummel is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

As Pat said.....High Collar Lock washers. Try Grainger Co. ….. 5/16 steel high collar lock washers on sale at $0.66 for a bag of 100.

That's right..... only 66 pennies for 100..... just in case you need a few.

Used them a lot on those Briggs Kart engines. Right Pat?
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Old 11-06-2018, 08:23:43 PM
machine and fab machine and fab is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

McMaster Carr has split lock washers for socket head bolts and screws. 562-692-5911.
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Old 11-06-2018, 09:20:58 PM
Pat Barrett Pat Barrett is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Usta use them on limited head bolts and on other fastners that Socket Head Cap Screws were allowed. I built a ton of 5 hp flat heads for people, some as far away as New York, and N. Carolina, down to New Orleans.

---------- Post added at 09:20:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:54:27 PM ----------

Blue, if you mail me, do so, normally, not thru Harry's site, sometimes it doesn't show up that way
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Old 11-06-2018, 10:31:39 PM
ronm ronm is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Split lockwashers are the worst type of holding device available. Horse-drawn technology. Just look at any place where a bolt or nut REALLY needs to stay tight...rod bolts, main bearing bolts, head bolts...no lockwashers.

I saw a discussion the other day about why a GMC pickup costs more than a Chevrolet. ..they use lock washers!
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Old 11-07-2018, 02:38:05 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Exclamation Re: lock washers different sizes?

Split washers are NOT used on internal parts of engines. They usually use castled nuts and cotter pins, or are safety wired to hold them in place. They ARE used on external mounting points, such as shroud work, carb mounting and other 'cold' mounting points. Hot work (Mufflers and exahust manifolds), as well as some con rods, use folding lock retainers, to keep bolts in place. Head bolts do not usually use washers, they depend on the torque stress to keep them in place.
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Old 11-07-2018, 02:48:38 PM
uglyblue66 uglyblue66 is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Well this thing is going to get pushed in and out of a trailer once in a while and just needs to stay in 1 piece. It did it for a long time as designed so it should be ok!.

Had trouble getting in, trying to change my contact email address and having barrels of trouble.
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Old 11-08-2018, 12:33:43 AM
Beanscoot Beanscoot is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Like just about everything else, nuts, bolts and lockwashers are continually declining in quality. One of the reasons is that they are almost always bought through distributors rather than manufacturers.
Distributors will buy from whoever is cheapest that week. Have you noticed that stainless steel flat washers are about the thickness of a tin can, and a very loose fit on a bolt?

I've repaired a fair number of lathes over the years, but I don't recall seeing lock washers under any of the socket head cap screws.

As for the performance of lockwashers, if they were originally used I will be sure to replace them (with good old ones), and it's probably true that they aren't really that good, except as paint wrecking devices.

When was the last time anyone saw a lock washer on a modern car?
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Old 11-09-2018, 10:25:17 PM
uglyblue66 uglyblue66 is offline
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Default Re: lock washers different sizes?

Problem solved,got a nice little package in the mail today with what I needed! Thanks for the help!
I am going to take 1 or 2 to the local hardware and talk to them.They have really expanded their inventory of bolts and such to a point I can find most anything BUT these washers.
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Old 11-11-2018, 10:07:18 PM
uglyblue66 uglyblue66 is offline
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Default Re: Lock Washers different sizes?

I had NO idea there was a hardware section of the forum! Wow.
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Old 11-11-2018, 10:32:32 PM
pegasuspinto pegasuspinto is offline
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Default Re: Lock Washers different sizes?

Part of the solution is to use SAE hardware, not USS. SAE is made to much tighter tolerances. USS washers rattle around on the stem so bad sometimes you wonder if the size isn't wrong.
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