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Twin City oil pressure issue


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  #1  
Old 04-16-2019, 10:50:12 PM
ajs2744TC ajs2744TC is offline
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Default Twin City oil pressure issue

This may have been covered before but here I go... Just got 27-44 number 250146 up and running. Trouble is that oil pressure at start up goes up but then quickly drops. I have never had this issue with any other TC and frankly I'm bewildered. Frustratingly! Had it apart tweaked it with new fittings and new balls etc. Havent done a new spring on it because original appeared ok. Gone through every scenario in my head and been down all roads. Am i overlooking something obvious? I haven't done a long run just primed carb but I would think like the others 20 second runs would draw up oil. Seems to not be sucking. Prime and pressure occurs for a bit.. like I've said never ever had such a thing.
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Old 04-17-2019, 08:17:35 AM
Gene Williams Gene Williams is offline
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Could it be there is a small hole in the suction line or a loose fitting that exposes itself when the oil is drawn out of the pan? Or maybe a blocked return passage preventing fast enough oil return that causes a low oil in the pan situation?
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Old 04-17-2019, 08:27:58 AM
Molinegb Molinegb is offline
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Apply suction to in line and see if oil comes up. Screen too fine.
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Old 04-17-2019, 10:36:45 AM
ajs2744TC ajs2744TC is offline
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

I pulled all the lines and pressure tested and suction tested. No leaks Eve visually inspected each tube. Oil goes out bearings and into crankcase so there's no return passage. I had thought about the screen being to fine but it's a repaired original. When I pull fitting oil runs out hole very quickly through it. Very very frustrating to say the least. Especially when most of the parts are way better shape than other TC's I have had 0 issues with. I can see oil bleed back from some wore parts but oil pressure up then vanishes right away seems confusing. Maybe I just need to run it longer at a higher rpm to get oil pumped up. Sure it's something dumb.
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Old 04-17-2019, 11:03:10 AM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

It's many years since I had one But. Did you Prime the oil pump after you put it back together. Oil pump needs to be wet to draw oil up from the pan the first time then should retain it's prime if you don't have any leaks.
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Old 04-17-2019, 11:54:19 AM
Molinegb Molinegb is offline
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

On my 12-20 oil pressure was low. I used a oil gun used for 80w. I connected to oil pressure line. Filled couple time and oil pressure came right up. Believed to be an air lock.
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Old 04-17-2019, 07:23:20 PM
ajs2744TC ajs2744TC is offline
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Yes it was primed before. But still seems to suck very little if any. As far as heavier oil for priming that's my next step I think. I've been suspecting an air lock or just lack of a longer higher idle run. Was using 10-30 but may go straight to 40w. Never had issues with this in past but also had went about first star tad differently as well.
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Old 04-17-2019, 09:12:48 PM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

If you're reasonably sure all the bearings are in good shape I think it's most likely too much clearance in the pump, most likely in the bottom cover but could also be worn bushings.
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Old 04-18-2019, 09:50:28 AM
ajs2744TC ajs2744TC is offline
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Possibly! But I do know pump cover bushing looks great but bushing in engine that shaft runs through for oil pump and water pump shows wear but nothing drastic. Pump gear runs close to case and clearance is very tight but clears no rubbing. Tractor many years ago shows primary shut down was due to valve piston carnage. I'm guessing it had oil pressure upon being parked. So maybe it's time to pull it outdoors and get it longer run start with more throttle and heavier prime oil.
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Old 04-18-2019, 10:29:39 AM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

On a side note, sometimes I go through these same periods of difficulty but different than most people in that sometimes it seems the more I fix the less it works.
Ever have that? I never considered myself a terrible mechanic but I wonder sometimes if its just elves at night messing with me or something.
I went through the pil pump on my 8-16 International years ago, really tried to make everything like new. On startup and run I couldn't get oil pressure to save myself, kept looking in the glass above the fan casting for oil bloops, nothing. So I filled the crankcase above the oil troughs and moved on. Sometime later I looked and LO AND BEHOLD< I HAD BLOOPS!
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Old 04-18-2019, 02:18:05 PM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

What is starting oil pressure? They don't have much to start with. What does it maintain? I use 15-40 and some use Aw32 hydraulic oil. Gears won't wear but bushings will.
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Old 04-18-2019, 02:57:48 PM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

10-30 may be too thin! What did the engine use originally - 30 Wt? Does the engine have a pressure relief valve? Maybe it is partially stuck open. With the 10-30, as the engine heats up, you will lose pressure as the clearances get larger with heat
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Old 04-18-2019, 10:16:48 PM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Russ and Molinegb. . As both you stated along with others the thing now has sat couple days. I tried to do oil pump up better than I found it like Russ's story. Elves? I could see that. After work Tonite I decided to peak in oil ports and found oil. In fact lots of oil. Now I was using the 10/30 because it's what I had in prime can? Crankcase had 30 wt. So I put some 30wt in can and squirted all ports right to top. Then as Molinegb said I put some 30wt and 80/90 in pump. 2 cranks off and running with 12lbs and second start & adjust 18lbs and it maintained with no fluctuations or drops to 0. I'm guessing that a couple days sit air bled out and the stiff oil helped with great pressure. Or the Elves decided to cut me a break. Either way I'm happy as long as 2 more days it doesn't fade away back to 0 lbs. Funny how I've done many of these without no fail at first prime and start and not until this old girl do I get a stubborn mule. Thought I was getting ready for the funny farm if I had to pull back apart again. So thanks and kudos! Anyone else have this issue again it's now solved.
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Old 04-18-2019, 10:30:08 PM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Couple pics if they downloaded. Now and many years ago with owner onboard threshing west of Bisbee, ND. Hope to get few more original pics from granddaughter.
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Old 04-19-2019, 01:18:21 AM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Great pics! I've been close and these big tractors are monsters!
Keep us updated.
re: Your next starts, if you would.
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Old 04-19-2019, 09:48:42 AM
ajs2744TC ajs2744TC is offline
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Next day or two it will roll out and get cooling tested better. Will keep an update on that but hoping for no leaks. Was hoping to throw up some more pics but my technology is fighting me on this end.few more pics as process played out. I decided once again to keep her in "work clothes" because of the high area of TC grey still showing. Figure why not if I wasn't fully restoring just bringing back to life. Rebuilt governor, nos piston and 7 new valves from H&J and 16 new guides. Lots and lots of flushing, cleaning and eviction notice to many dead mice and there bean hoard. Magneto cleaned and serviced. Timing gear & shaft repair. List goes on.... But we all know that drill.
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Old 04-19-2019, 10:10:16 AM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Lol few more. As I mentioned to Mark the TC parts manuals on some parts will list what engine uses what part number etc. The engine in this tractor had very poor machining with some water ports right next to sleeves and way off from water hole in head. In fact with heads down about 1/8 of the block deck sticks out in front of heads and heads hangover in back. Even with the heads drawn tight against studs. Someone was having a case of the Mondays 93 years ago. engine is 200144 and first one to use the latest low vent "b" series valve covers. Which I thought were wrong and almost changed out. Good thing for manufacturer notes. And if anyone cares I do in a box have correct fan pulley and drive pulley. Just wanted to try farmer V belt for a season. Here few more pics...I'm not very good at project documentation.
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Old 04-19-2019, 11:31:22 AM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

That's great, man, if I just had the money there was one here ready to sell not far from here, I always thought that would be as close as I would ever come to a prairie tractor.
On the dead mouse eviction, good thing mice aren't as prized as human life or else we would have to leave them where they fell as a memorial.
The mice have been BAD this winter and spring at my place.
By the way, years ago I restored an F-14 for a local guy that came from south of here and it had tiny yellow dead scorpions in several of the cylinders.
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Old 04-19-2019, 05:00:21 PM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

Yeah I kind of have a bad feeling for the poor critters but after draining 4 gallon of oil and a gallon or two of mouse pee water from pan. That for 7 months stunk up my shop that guilt went down. Another issue found but I feel ok going with as the one head had rusted out between 2 water ports through in some spots. But they were share chamber so I just doped and moved on. Darn acid mouse urine is so destructive. It was the rear head that had broke & dropped a valve head off destroying piston and 2 other valves. So I believe that was the choice peeing for distance contest hangout.
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Old 04-19-2019, 06:28:50 PM
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Default Re: Twin City oil pressure issue

When my uncle bought the 17-28 I own the side of the head had rusted through, hadn't seen that on any others. The owner had a piece of rubber in between the block and the head as it sat outside, that saved the engine really well.
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