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Hit & Miss Gas Engine Discussion Meet collectors of hit and miss engines, ask questions about collecting, restoring and showing antique flywheel engines.

Hit & Miss Gas Engine Discussion

Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems


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  #1  
Old 08-16-2019, 11:55:42 AM
Stakeside Stakeside is offline
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Default Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

I am having trouble figuring this simple machine out.
It backfires and I need to retard the spark. Not sure how to
start. Mine has a Wico mag.
Looking for information on setting retard/advance. Is this a type 2 trigger setup?

Are there any basic instructions available? My series number is TA 12160.

Thanks for your assistance.
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  #2  
Old 08-17-2019, 12:56:23 AM
cobbadog cobbadog is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Are you a tooth out or just need a fine tune adjustment?
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Old 08-17-2019, 01:24:05 PM
Stakeside Stakeside is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

I am a novice at this.
Are there some timing marks on engine? I can always try setting tigger 10 degrees BTC.
Also what type of tigger assemble would this be in pic. Not sure how to adjust.
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Old 08-17-2019, 09:42:12 PM
Gene Williams Gene Williams is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Generally fire at top dead center with the little sheet metal tab in the picture as it is. It is to advance the timing when it is down behind the spring. The timing is adjusted by the two nuts behind the larger spring. Compressing the spring should advance the timing.
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Old 08-17-2019, 11:18:00 PM
Odin Odin is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

There should be a ridge on the face of the cam gearthat serves as a timing mark. I can tell from the casting set that this is one of the Nelson-built Sattey engines. Would have to go look at my engine again to tell which direction the ridge should face. But it will be passing either 3:00 or 9:00 when the piston is at TDC, I'd have to look again to remember which. Probably either one would be valid.

Be careful working with it, they have a reputation for firing backwards and breaking your arm if you didn't let go in time. The deal is the flame path is rather long, and so the ignition has to be rather advanced to get power. But that highly advanced ignition- as much as 30 degrees before TDC means that if you come up on compression too slowly it will fire backwards and hurt you.

The magneto drive should have a flap on the fork. Set the timing with the flap lowered- the advanced position for running. Raise the flap for starting, which retards the mag trip so it isn't as likely to break your arm.

While your engine is a throttle governed built around the TA casting set, mine is a hit & miss built on the T casting set. The T and TA casting sets are very nearly the same and can interchange parts, but your engine would have a different governor and carburetor due to its throttle governed specification instead of hit & miss with a simple mixer like mine.
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Old 08-19-2019, 11:53:07 AM
Stakeside Stakeside is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Thanks for help. I was able to get it running. Using starting fluid may part of my problem with the back fire.
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Old 08-19-2019, 06:56:00 PM
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Rich Mueller Sr Rich Mueller Sr is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Listen to Odin carefully!!! That's is NO BS, I have a type U Little Jumbo, and it DID mangle the original owners son's wrist back around the depression era!! I found it through a friend as a freshman in high school, in a pump house all its life, they had sold the land for a housing development , we got the engine from developer , wish I had got the Goulds pump to, but they had a sale after we got it and met the owners son, and his wrist was never the same, they couldn't afford or didn't have the doctors we have today, and you could defiantly could see the mangled wrist he lived with all his life. These have a unique carb on them, instead of the usual butterfly valve in carb throat, it has a 1/2" rod with a slot cut in it that regulates the fuel air going in, mine has a lot of slop from wear and not the best smooth runner, but it will burn lamp oil or anything that will burn!! Still has a Edison plug in it and original paint. The owners told us in the depression in hard times they mixed gasoline , drain oil, kerosene , even a little moonshine burned in it, and in WW2. Once you get used to one another you can experiment what it will run on by using the little starting tank , and gas in main tank to clean it out before shutdown. Oh, One more little CAUTION, NEVER EVER,, stick your hand in crank area to turn the grease cups down, or unloading, loading at a show, without pulling plug wire off and grounding the wire to frame!! You roll the engine while trying to load or turn the grease cup it goes bang , your going to the hospital!! Mine fired just moving it in the shed and rolled a wheel after sitting 2 weeks , true story!!
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Old 08-20-2019, 06:34:53 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Exclamation Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Any flywheeled engine will definately mes you up, if not timed correctly or moved without respect of moving parts. many years ago, I lost the tip of a finger to a moving flywheel. Cost about 7,000 to get it fixed!

The WICO EK should be set to fire at TDC compression retarded to prevent kick back. Timing is advanced by dropping the lever in place after starting. yes you can advance further but you risk wrist breaks if you do so. If you use a hand crank to roll the engine over, NEVER push down on the crank! Roll the engine over backwards against the compression stroke and PULL UP on the compression stroke. NEVER wrap your hand or your thumb fully around the crank handle, use your fingers in a half circle. If the engine kicks back, the handle will be pulled from your hand and it will not break your thumb, wrist or worse.
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Old 08-20-2019, 06:42:50 PM
casertractor casertractor is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stakeside View Post
Are there any basic instructions available?

Try here

www.hitnmiss.com
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Old 08-20-2019, 10:48:42 PM
casertractor casertractor is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

That spark plug wire looks like it needs some attention up near the magneto.Have you tried cleaning up the spark plug?
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Old 08-23-2019, 12:02:29 PM
Stakeside Stakeside is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Plug is good and spark is strong. Got a good bite from it.

I have got it to fire. Other times it wouldn’t fire. It backfires.
1) you need a full hard pull. Nothing half hearted.
2) magneto moving parts must be free. Any hang up will effect spark timing.
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Old 08-27-2019, 08:36:42 PM
Kvt Kvt is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Mine is a hit and miss, It has a mark on the inside of one of the flywheels for ignition timing, and marks on the other for valve timing. It will kick back if not careful.
You can find a bit about the Wico Mags on youtube. Make sure that it is clean does not stick, and pulls down straight. If not it will mess with the timing also.

Mine is down right now for a full rebuild.
And yours looks a lot like my Little Jumbo which is also made by Nelson bothers but with spokes instead of the dish flywheels.
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Old 09-11-2019, 12:20:34 PM
Stakeside Stakeside is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

After I got a gas tank hooked up it runs great. I do need an engine oilier. Any ideas what type to use?
Thanks for all your assistance in this mater.
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Old 09-19-2019, 03:11:17 PM
Bob Brown Bob Brown is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Anytime I turn a flywheel engine over I expect it to fire on the compression stroke. I try to be ready for it to start, even if I know it can't
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Old 09-20-2019, 09:22:50 AM
Kvt Kvt is offline
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Default Re: Sattley 1 1/2 hp starting problems

Mine just has the normal Drip oiler, then the little oil area on the caps for the main bearings. which someone told me once should have a little wick type thing so it would drip down onto the main. Have not seen one set up to check. Mine is in pieces right now for a full rebuild.
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