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Chinese clone engines


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  #21  
Old 08-18-2012, 04:09:48 PM
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Earlier this year I was amazed to see Husqvarna mowers at Home Depot that had Kohler engines on them. Just under $200.
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  #22  
Old 08-19-2012, 11:10:23 AM
Larry Rarus
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

So what I'm reading here is that if our currently young children were to visit this site (or one like it) in their adulthood they'd be discussing engines made by Chongqing Bien Technology Co., Ltd., or NINGBO WELLY MACHINERY & TOOLS Co., Ltd, or Zhejiang Ousen Machinery Co., Ltd., or Changzhou Beiante Power Machinery Co., Ltd., or Fuzhou Kapur Power Equipment Co., Ltd., or Taizhou Genour Power Machinery Co., Ltd., or Yongkang Sayes Industry & Trade Co., Ltd., or.....should I go on? We're OK with this? (By the way, I didn't make up any of those names. They're Chinese manufacturers of small engines.) Heaven help us. All to save a buck. That's that many more Americans out of work.
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  #23  
Old 08-19-2012, 11:35:24 AM
jgreen416 jgreen416 is online now
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

I can clearly hear my mother, 50 years ago, "eat your food, people are starving in China". Not so much anymore, they're eatingour, lunch.
JG
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  #24  
Old 08-19-2012, 12:07:30 PM
Kammer0072000 Kammer0072000 is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

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Originally Posted by Larry Rarus View Post
That's that many more Americans out of work.
Canadians too.
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  #25  
Old 08-19-2012, 02:07:52 PM
sprkplug sprkplug is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Well.... I believe the ever expanding use of automation, coupled with the outsourcing of domestic production, has accounted for far more American jobs being lost than some competition from a Chinese engine.

Perhaps the increase in importation has resulted in additional jobs being created in the US Customs, and/or shipping arenas? And all those Chinese engines are going to need a distribution network, bound to be some jobs created there. Those engines suffer from fuel related issues the same as our beloved American engines do, Somebody has to work on them, and provide replacement parts (subassemblies, usually), sounds like an opportunity for more work...

I know this is an Antique engine board, and it's fine to lament the passing of the good ole' days, when Kohlers were made of cast iron , engines had points, and carburetors had two adjustment screws, BUT... the simple truth is, that won't pay the bills.

Times are tight....saving money by purchasing an offshore engine, or making money by performing service and repair on that same engine, (guilty!), just makes sense for some people.
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  #26  
Old 08-19-2012, 02:38:10 PM
Ianhw77k Ianhw77k is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Rarus View Post
So what I'm reading here is that if our currently young children were to visit this site (or one like it) in their adulthood they'd be discussing engines made by Chongqing Bien Technology Co., Ltd., or NINGBO WELLY MACHINERY & TOOLS Co., Ltd, or Zhejiang Ousen Machinery Co., Ltd., or Changzhou Beiante Power Machinery Co., Ltd., or Fuzhou Kapur Power Equipment Co., Ltd., or Taizhou Genour Power Machinery Co., Ltd., or Yongkang Sayes Industry & Trade Co., Ltd., or.....should I go on? We're OK with this? (By the way, I didn't make up any of those names. They're Chinese manufacturers of small engines.) Heaven help us. All to save a buck. That's that many more Americans out of work.
Do something about it America, it happened over here in the UK decades ago and it won't just be your engines!
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  #27  
Old 08-20-2012, 10:55:16 AM
Subzero Subzero is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

I had one of these clones on my mini bike ( Baja MB 165 ). It had TONS of issues but it did have lots of hours on it. I've worked on these more than anything and I can say, you take a chance when buying one if it will last or not. I bought the minibike used because it was a steal and it just happened to have one on it already. I replaced it with a real Honda GX160 ASAP. Lets just say you wouldnt see me buying a new one. I would save my money or buy a used Honda off craigslist. I got mine never had gas or oil in it for $120 off of CL. So its well worth the money to get a real Honda. But i've noticed its either a love or hate engine. Its your choice. I would say temperary uses the clone would be most cost effective but if you need an engine that will last and you can depend on get a Honda.
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  #28  
Old 08-20-2012, 11:35:58 AM
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Newman, Jr. View Post
Earlier this year I was amazed to see Husqvarna mowers at Home Depot that had Kohler engines on them. Just under $200.
That kolher is a Chinese built engine. Bought one last fall of CL for 35 dollars, hard starting, but runs pretty good.
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  #29  
Old 08-20-2012, 03:20:29 PM
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Just got a couple of 4-stroke Ryobi weedeater powerheads from a store return item liquidator (TaddWholesale - through eBay). Listing said 'No compression'. I found just the opposite - Would not pull over. Reason: Cylinders full of oil. Pulled the sparkplugs and pulled through several times to clear the oil from the cylinders, cleaned the plug off and both fired right up and sounded healthy. Paid $40 each including shipping. Interesting engines - Cog-belt driven overhead cam. Of course, they are made in China. Once again, I made a pretty good score because the average consumer has no idea how things work (or even how they are supposed to...)
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  #30  
Old 08-20-2012, 05:33:11 PM
jgreen416 jgreen416 is online now
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Not just engines. Some years back I worked across the street from the Timken Bearing world headquarters in the U.S. I needed a couple of thrust bearings and went to a local bearingdistributor. "You want good ones or cheap ones" the clerk asked. "Tell me about them" I replied. "Good ones come from Romania, cheap ones from China".
That's the way it is.
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  #31  
Old 08-20-2012, 07:43:31 PM
Tom Nowak Tom Nowak is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Friend got a Ryobi 4 cycle push type weed eater. The second time he used it,it quit. I took the cover off. I forget if it was a gear or cam. Which ever it was, it was made of plastic and it had broke. He took it back and they gave him a new weed eater. The second lasted two or three times before it quit. We didn't take the cover off that time, he just took it back and got his money back.

A little off subject. I have must of the 18 volt Ryobi hand tools and have had good luck with them. I do carpenter work and I get along good with them. I like it that all of the 18 volt tools take the same battery.

I have used Dewalt and Milwaukee tools also. the Dewalt tools were good but the batteries where so high I tried the Ryobi and I could not see much difference. the batteries were half as high and seemed to last just as long. Also Dewalt kept changing their style of batteries. The Milwaukee tools I stoped using when Dewalt came out with their 18 volt tools and all Milwaukee had was 12 volt.
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  #32  
Old 08-21-2012, 10:19:48 PM
Larry Rarus
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

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Originally Posted by sprkplug View Post
I know this is an Antique engine board, and it's fine to lament the passing of the good ole' days, when Kohlers were made of cast iron , engines had points, and carburetors had two adjustment screws, BUT... the simple truth is, that won't pay the bills.

Times are tight....saving money by purchasing an offshore engine, or making money by performing service and repair on that same engine, (guilty!), just makes sense for some people.
I am not lamenting the passing of the "good ol' days". Time marches on, as it should. Period. This is about national economics and transcends any concept of which engine may be perceived as better. The Chinese engines are not so much serviced as modularly replaced. That's not servicing. Buying the Chinese knock-offs when it's convenient and saving the purchase of a quality engine only when necessary is a dream. It assumes the "quality" engines will be there when required. Businesses cannot sustain engineering and manufacturing costs in a diminished market and will ultimately fall by the wayside, leaving only the cheaper and lesser quality manufacturers remaining. Also, the replacement parts for those engines only helps those manufacturers as the spare parts (also made in China) need to be manufactured, exported, imported and purchased stateside. Ultimately the money goes offshore. It's about time that America (and Canada!) begins to reassert itself. Every person who on his own thinks, "My one purchase won't matter much" needs to look at the big picture. If thousands or millions of people take that posture then it does indeed add up. It's like voting. Don't bother, or leave it to the next guy, and you'll almost certainly be disappointed.

Make a stand. Keep Americans employed. Buy American. Let's put those on the North American continent in first place. It will ultimately benefit all of us.....or you could just save fifty bucks and chuck the whole thing.
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  #33  
Old 08-22-2012, 08:00:55 AM
Ed Sparks Ed Sparks is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

The problem is with the corporate greed and stockholders demanding higher returns , the American worker has been replaced with offshore cheap.

Companies no longer care where their product is manufactured as long as they increase profits.

Time to put tariffs at the port of entry that make it cheaper to manufacture here again. Send all those shiploads of chinese toxic crap back where it came from.

Put Wallymart out of business

end of my morning rant:
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  #34  
Old 08-22-2012, 08:18:38 AM
sprkplug sprkplug is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Okay, then where do those American OEM's who purchase Chinese engines to use on their stateside-built equipment fit into the picture? MTD installs Chinese engines everday on their production lines, I see pushmowers built under the Yard-Man, Troy-Bilt, and Cub Cadet names equipped with offshore engines all the time. Since the demise of Tecumseh, and the recent re-introduction of Lauson....built by LCT, (a Chinese engine), I expect to see many of these engines used on snowblowers, as Tecumseh always commanded the lion's share of that market.

And, let's not forget that old stalwart of American iron, the John Deere. Premium JD lawn and garden tractors have used JAPANESE engines for years... Kawasaki's and Honda's have appeared on higher priced equipment for decades, and they are superb engines. I have no doubt, however, that when they first began making inroads into the U.S. market that many such similar conversations as this one surely took place.... and yet, here we are, still here.

And we wouldn't want to forget that Briggs now has an engine in their Vanguard lineup, their premium line, that is a Chinese made engine... of course, we already knew that the entire Vanguard series was a joint effort between Briggs and Diahatsu, didn't we?

And those fellows over at Wisconsin Motors even worked together with Fuji Heavy Industries for awhile. They did incorporate an American songbird into the name, though.

It's fine, and expected, to wave the flag and preach patriotism in situations such as this. I was born and raised in the USA, and I'm as proud to be an American as anyone on this board. But to imply that individuals purchasing stand-alone engines to repower their equipment with, will lead to the demise of American companies, the very same companies who are purchasing those exact engines by the shipping containers full to use on their own production lines, is too hard to swallow.

I am in agreement with you on one point, however. If the influx of Chinese built engines into the country is to be curbed, then money will certainly be the tool by which it is accomplished. If consumers were to quit purchasing new equipment that came equipped with offshore engines, the tide would turn. Manufacturers build to suit a market segment, whether it be based on price, quality, or something else entirely. Eliminate the demand for lower priced equipment, and that equipment disappears.

Convincing the general population that they need to spend an extra $500 on a riding mower, or an additional $100 on a pushmower, is not a job I would care to have, however.
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  #35  
Old 08-22-2012, 10:02:47 AM
Larry Rarus
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

I pretty much agree on all points. I would just like to get people thinking of the long term consequences of things. Perhaps that has been accomplished at least to a small degree.
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  #36  
Old 08-22-2012, 11:46:58 AM
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

One problem with buying American (or Canadian) is it is really difficult to tell where stuff is built anymore.

Craftsman Tools - China, Japan, US and others
ViseGrip - China
Ford - US, Canada, Brazil, Mexico, Australia, Mexico and more
Toyota - Everywhere including 6 US and 2 Canadian plants
Dodge - mine was built in Mexico
Honda - Ohio (and everywhere else)

Currently made in China is a dirty phrase with most of us. It will not always be so. Just look at a GoPro camera. Weighs 2 oz. Excellent quality, very rugged, case is waterproof to over 200 ft depth (yeah that is a real number, I have done it.) and TV quality HD video. Oh, and under $300. Used by the ton on shows like Deadliest Catch.

As far as buying Chinese engines from HF and swapping them out under warranty? My time is worth more than that. Plus I can't afford to not be able to depend on the equipment. But I imagine their day will come.

And sooner than we think.

I would like my next import to be from the UK. Like a large Blackstone
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  #37  
Old 08-24-2012, 06:09:57 PM
Bowtiebutler956 Bowtiebutler956 is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

Bought an 09 Chevy Silverado in 09. Drove it a couple months before looking at the tag in the door. Made in Mexico! I thought I was buying American!

Matt
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  #38  
Old 09-29-2014, 01:24:55 PM
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Red face Re: Chinese clone engines

I remember back in the 60's and early 70's when my parents and their friends complained about all of the junk coming from Japan, now look who we mainly depend on for daily life (cars, trucks, TV's, stereos, washers and dryers and the such). Maybe someday the Chinese junk will be fairly good, too. It has gotten better in the last ten years.
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  #39  
Old 10-01-2014, 03:03:31 AM
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

In the 80's I picked up 3 used 50's & 70's era engines that were Briggs, this when I already had a Briggs 5S I picked from a trashed reel mower labeled Moto Mower Company founded 1919. I only kept the cast iron engine from the mower and it is solid. Later the 3 engine another 5S, a 6S, and an 80202 0430 Briggs light weight aluminum 3hp is far more reliable on my small power home built off road trail bike, than what is sold as over seas kit engines for similar. Mostly I can say the magneto is one of the things I hear bad on the import cheapies. I resisted getting the electronic ignition module and still have the points, which may not be the smartest after revamping the 3hp. It still with a 21:1 reduction to a 26 inch wheel has had a lot of trail ground covered. Parts either I buy or if I can do make parts with whatever I get my hands on.

Picture taken before I put fork with front shocks and lower handle bars for better center of gravity.
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  #40  
Old 10-01-2014, 11:47:54 AM
Jim Metzger Jim Metzger is offline
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Default Re: Chinese clone engines

I bought an Earth Quake mini tiller with a Viper(Chinese) 43 cc 2-cycle engine last year. It came with Vipers own oil which I used. I read the instructions as to a proper break in procedure, none was mentioned. It also said in the manual not to idle the engine but run in wide open. I mixed up the oil with 87 octane methanol gas and went to work. This little engine screamed it heart out as it had on governor and to nobody's surprise it wiped out the rings in less than a tank of gas. Since it had a 2 year warranty I took it back to the dealer and got a whole new tiller with the same engine, no questions asked. I asked what happens when this engine does the same thing and the original 2 year warranty is up. He then said, you are on your own.
So much for my experience with Chinese engines. I see why Honda sells so many mini tillers even at twice the price.
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