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Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)


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  #1  
Old 08-13-2012, 10:27:46 PM
55gasser 55gasser is offline
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Default Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

Hey guys I need some help!! I made what I thought was a great trade on a air compressor thru Craigs list and now I dont have a clue how to hook it up!!!! This is a three phase and I assume I have to convert it to single phase.(I dont have a 3 phase service that I know of.)The converters are almost as much as the compressor. Do I need to go with the convertor or should I get a single phase 5 hp motor.
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Old 08-13-2012, 11:16:47 PM
dalmatiangirl61 dalmatiangirl61 is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

That looks like a pretty nice compressor, depending on what you traded it for it its not a bad deal. Your best 2 options are a 10 HP rotary phase converter, or swapping out motor for a 5 hp single phase motor, maybe even a 7.5 hp motor. I'd stay away from the static converters. Building a phase converter is not that hard, although there are several ways to do it, do you have an old 10Hp 3 phase motor lying around? For heavy loads like compressors you want rotary converter sized 2x the motor you want to run. Google "rotary phase converter plans", that should give you something to think about.
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Old 08-14-2012, 11:05:48 AM
Richard W. Richard W. is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

If you have a 1800 RPM 10 HP 3 phase motor, then you can get this kit to make to make your own phase converter. 1800 RPM motors run quieter than a 3600 RPM motor.

If you change out the motor to single phase then you may need to rewire your compressor for the increased AMP load of the single phase motor, along with the motor starter and pressure switch. Single phase draws about twice the AMP load of 3 phase. If I read the plate right from the picture it said 14 AMPS 3 phase. The 5 HP single phase motor I have draws 27.5 AMPS. So that would be something to look at.

Richard W.

---------- Post added at 08:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:02 AM ----------

I forgot to post the link to the kit.

http://ebay.com/itm/10-HP-manual-start-ROTARY-PHASE-CONVERTER-CONTROL-PANEL-/300527356835

Most likely a home built phase converter will be the lowest cost for you.

Richard W.
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Old 08-14-2012, 03:21:56 PM
55gasser 55gasser is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

What will happen if I go with just a static phase converter?
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Old 08-14-2012, 06:55:57 PM
Richard W. Richard W. is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

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Originally Posted by 55gasser View Post
What will happen if I go with just a static phase converter?
You loose 1/3 the power from your compressor motor with a static phase converter. Most likely it won't start and if it does will soon stall out under load. Then you blow the start capacitors in the static converter. I wouldn't do it. I tryed it on a lathe that had no clutch and it would run at low speed but at full speed it blew the capacitors and never got up to speed. Your compressor needs to be full speed all the time.

Richard W.
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Old 08-14-2012, 07:39:44 PM
55gasser 55gasser is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

Richard
Between your answer and some other research I have done today the static phase converter is definately out! I am now in limbo between the 10hp rotary converter and the 5hp single phase motor. If I go with the 5hp single phase motor what will I have to change as far as the switches go!
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Old 08-14-2012, 09:20:13 PM
Richard W. Richard W. is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

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Originally Posted by 55gasser View Post
Richard
Between your answer and some other research I have done today the static phase converter is definately out! I am now in limbo between the 10hp rotary converter and the 5hp single phase motor. If I go with the 5hp single phase motor what will I have to change as far as the switches go!
You will have to change the motor start contactor in the gray box. The pressure switch may have to be changed also, but would need to be looked at. Not being an electrician, but I am able to wire my lathe and compressor in. Do you have someone close by that could look at it?

The other thing I found out when I changed a lathe from 3 phase to single phase by switching the motor, it would have been cheaper to get a rotary phase converter. Then I would already have 3 phase power for future machines.

Richard W.
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Old 08-14-2012, 09:37:17 PM
J.B. Castagnos J.B. Castagnos is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

The rotary convertor will have to run continuously while using the compressor, if you just go in the shop occasionally it may be OK, if you want to leave the compressor on it's not the best choice. A single phase motor would be better. Depending on your needs you may get by with a 3hp, smaller pulley to load motor under it's maximum draw. 5hp may need a smaller pulley also, check your amperage when it's running. The three phase starting switch may work, you'll have an extra leg, no problem. It depends on the coil, if it's 208-240 you should be OK.
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Old 08-14-2012, 11:09:08 PM
dalmatiangirl61 dalmatiangirl61 is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

Using the 3 phase starter with single phase is not a problem, as JB said you just have an unused leg. I suspect the pressure switch is 120V, the one on my compressor is. I run a phase converter for my compressor, its kind of a pain, and converter could use some new bearings so its as loud as compressor, only upside is no one ever forgets to turn the compressor off.

A friend uses a static converter for his lathe and mill, quite honestly I'm surprised he has not burnt the motors up, its easily 30 seconds to a minute for them to get up to speed. He tried running a 3hp 3phase compressor on it, it popped the capacitors in under a week, he swapped motor out for a 5hp single phase motor from Tractor Supply, and he's burnt up 2 of those in past 5 years.

If you plan on getting any lathes/mills or other 3 phase equipment you might as well step up to 3 phase now. Depending on where you are 3 phase might be available already, of course that means a 3 phase meter loop, panel, runs, and another power bill to pay, unless you switch everything over to the new circuit.
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Old 08-14-2012, 11:27:22 PM
55gasser 55gasser is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

Were is the cheapest place to get a 10hp rotary converter? All of them I have looked at are $700 and up! Made a trade on this compressor and thought I was a step ahead of the game and now as always I find out different!!!!!!
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Old 08-14-2012, 11:50:05 PM
Richard W. Richard W. is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

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Originally Posted by 55gasser View Post
Were is the cheapest place to get a 10hp rotary converter? All of them I have looked at are $700 and up! Made a trade on this compressor and thought I was a step ahead of the game and now as always I find out different!!!!!!
Look on craig's list for a used 10 HP motor and buy the unit in the link above to build your own. You should be able to build one for about 1/2 of buying one.

To test a 3 phase motor on single phase take a start capacitor with you with 2 wires connected about a foot long. Wire up the two legs to the motor and throw the switch and as quickly as you can touch one wire of the capacitor to one of the hot wires and the other to the motor leg with no power. If it's a good motor it will start, then remove the capacitor once it spinning. Then listen for bearing noise and if everything looks and sounds OK then it most likely is a good one to buy.

Richard W.
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Old 08-15-2012, 12:08:15 AM
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

This is the motor I put on my compressor. It is about the biggest 5 hp motor I have ever seen. Shipping weight is 110 lbs. 230 VAC single phase. Draws 26 amps. Service factor is 1.15. It is electrically reversable. It is $450 + shipping. This one is 3500 rpm, but I think they have a 1750 version available.
When I am using the blasting cabinet, the compressor runs for hours at a time and this motor never lets me down.
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.as...-1093&catname=
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Old 08-15-2012, 11:16:25 AM
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

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Originally Posted by Richard W. View Post
...Most likely it won't start and if it does will soon stall out under load. Then you blow the start capacitors in the static converter. ...
My experience was different. I had a 5HP 3-phase industrial compressor running on a static with no issues. But, I made some tweaks:
  1. don't run the pump up to 175 psi. Set the cut-off as low as you can - 130 psi ought to be enough.
  2. reduce the motor pulley to about 80% of it's original size. Check the motor current on each line to be sure you're under the nameplate rating.
  3. Use synthetic compressor oil if it needs to start in a cold ambient

I think a rotary converter is a bad choice if you only need to run a compressor. Another story if you have a shop full of 3 phase motors.

Quote:
...Using the 3 phase starter with single phase is not a problem...
Hmm. Might want to check your starter ratings. Single phase motor load ratings of contactors and switches are typically a lot lower than 3-phase ratings...
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Old 08-15-2012, 11:44:23 AM
RSCurtis RSCurtis is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

What would your utility charge to bring in 3-phase power, assuming it's nearby? It's a much better power source for a compressor than single phase.
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Old 08-15-2012, 01:23:02 PM
Richard W. Richard W. is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

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Originally Posted by RSCurtis View Post
What would your utility charge to bring in 3-phase power, assuming it's nearby? It's a much better power source for a compressor than single phase.
It's usually only for business and schools, everywhere else there is a charge to hang the extra wire. That is why rotary phase converters are so popular. I live in the country and the only reason it's close is because of a school up the road from me about 6 miles. I would have to pay to string the lines about 1500 feet to my house if I wanted it.

Richard W.
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Old 08-16-2012, 06:30:49 PM
55gasser 55gasser is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

(Quote from ingersol Rand) The 2340 is a great compressor pump. You will need to make sure that the 5hp motor has the same sheave size as the 3ph carries currently. The starter and pressure switch will probably require replacing when you convert to single phase.

My question to them was,In order to convert to a single phase 5hp motor will I be able to use my starter and pressure switch? And is there any certain things to look for in a motor?

Now my question is. What 5hp single phase motor is compatable with mine as far as "sheave size" goes????
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Old 08-16-2012, 07:20:29 PM
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

Sheave is just another word for pulley.
When I put that big single phase 5hp motor on my compressor, the little pressure switch that came with the compressor was only rated at 15 amps (230V). I got a relay with 40 amp rated contacts from Grainger with 120V coil and now the pressure switch only triggers the relay to start the compressor motor.
Always go with cast iron pulleys. Here is a good source for any size you might need (and reasonably priced, too!)
This link is a PDF of a catalog page. Find the part number for the one you want and go to www.surpluscenter.com and enter that part number in the search box for details on that item.
https://www.surpluscenter.com/pages/Catalog285-116.pdf
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Old 08-16-2012, 10:25:46 PM
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

If you get a 5HP single phase motor, just make sure it has the same shaft size, and re-use the pulley from the 3 phase motor. And probably obvious, but make sure you find a 1750 rpm motor, since that's probably what the 3 phase motor was...

Agree w/ John - get a contactor (with 240V coil ) and wire your existing pressure switch to control that...
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Old 08-21-2012, 01:49:12 AM
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

Find a 10 hp 3 phase motor and build a rotary converter. You may find some other 3 phase equipment in the future. I have a 5hp Champion air compressor running off mine.
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Old 08-21-2012, 01:42:57 PM
Mike G Mike G is offline
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Default Re: Ingersol Rand Compressor (How to hook up?)

Another option may be a VFD. Many can take single phase input and output 3 phase. This one is only good for 3 hp, but gives you an idea of what to look for:

[URL="http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Drives/GS2_%28115_-z-_230_-z-_460_-z-_575_VAC_V-z-Hz_Control%29/GS2_Drive_Units_%28115_-z-_230_-z-_460_-z-_575_VAC%29/GS2-23P0"]

I have had good luck using this on a smaller drill press, but I am not sure how they would perform in air compressor duty.

Mike
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