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Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats

Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir


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  #21  
Old 12-26-2012, 02:12:59 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Hey Rick do not call me Mr. Clemens.
Only my Lawyer talks that way or when i am in the courthouse, have an new paspoort, drivers licens.etc ....



Keep the pictures coming in...........
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Old 12-26-2012, 03:26:21 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Quote:
Originally Posted by G Willikers View Post
Mr. Clemens - I have one exhaust whistle! Have not decided which tractor to mount it on yet!
Whatever you do don't mount it on a 2 cylinder tractor.......it'll sound really REALLY stooopid.......
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  #23  
Old 12-26-2012, 03:34:29 PM
Joe P Joe P is offline
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Here is our Beaver tractor. My dad originally would have got it from Jud Tracy in Carrington ND around 1980. Unfortunately thats about all that is know any more on our end. Photo's are kind of poor, dark in the shed and 0 degrees this morning so I may have been a little shaky. Maybe Craig can brighten them up a bit.

Craig here.......dun.......
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Old 12-26-2012, 03:55:48 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Joe,
Thanks for posting those pictures - your hands will warm up again some day! Any chance the serial number plate is on the dash board? When we talked about that one, you mentioned it had the bigger Waukesha motor @ 4.75x6.75? (I also have a record of them using a 5x6.25 but I am not sure about that!) Your's is what they called a 30-15 and they had an earlier designation, something like 28-14. There aren't many of that model. Manitoba Ag Museum at Austin has a 30-15.
The one I have is an early 24-12. I always enjoy running that tractor. The friction drive is slick! It is a nice handling tractor all 'round! Yes, based on Heider design but built in Brantford with some considerable differences.
RM
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Old 12-26-2012, 04:50:40 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Thanks for posting all those pictures, that Ideal is still music in the video.

I picked this neat brochure up last year of the Beaver, they are large files so I'll just link them.

http://rockislandplowco.com/misc/Beaver1.jpg
http://rockislandplowco.com/misc/Beaver2.jpg

Its really hard to look at a Beaver and not see at least a strong Heider influence. Rick and I have chatted a fair bit about possible connections between the two, but nothing at all exists as solid evidence there was an agreement or link between the two companies.

One thing thats really interesting though, is that GS&M copied Rock Islands friction drive illistration for its literature. Another argument for an agreement is that Rock Island would have been ending its agreement with Gilson as a distributor and no negotiations were even in the works with Waterloo yet for a Canadian distributor when the beaver was debuting. Tariffs on import tractors to Canada were high anyway, and Rock Island was already working on licensing the Heider design in France for the same reasons (the Rip) so the timing and circumstances are plausible for the Beaver to have been a licensed clone.
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Old 12-26-2012, 04:53:42 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Very nice tractor! Would love to see it run in person!

Here's some scans of a cabinet photo I have of one of these tractors.





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Old 12-26-2012, 05:15:28 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Darn it! My thanx button is running on low again!
So thanks to Paul and to Jeff for the great additions and to anyone else on here that didn't get thanked. Also to Craig, thanks for all your help.
Paul - I'll have more to say about the Beaver tractors at a later date - want to go through the two cylinder ones first!
And Jeff, that is a fantastic picture! You can just spot a drip oiler for the cylinder and that shows up also in some catalogue views. They only feed oil to the cylinders and the main and crank bearings are on grease cups! Also, it may have had the exhaust out the side - the one at Reynolds-Alberta Museum has side exhausts, if memory serves, with mufflers. I doub't that any two were the same anyway!
Man, I hope more people can contribute items!
RM
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Old 12-26-2012, 06:06:58 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

And a few more shots for today - inside the machine shops.
The one picture shows in the tractor erecting shop on the east side of Clarence Street in Brantford. The GS&M buildings are long gone.
Another pic is of the patented steering gear - looking up from underneath the tractor. It steers like a dream!
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Old 12-27-2012, 04:50:07 AM
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Wink Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig A View Post
Whatever you do don't mount it on a 2 cylinder tractor.......it'll sound really REALLY stooopid.......
Craig it looks now that you have already have been practice.




Rick i have another very beautiful one for you.

Chris,
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Old 12-27-2012, 02:11:17 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Here is the 2nd two cylinder series from about 1911. Rated at 28-20 and 45-30, motor dimensions were the same as the first group.
These were the ugly ducklings in my opinion. But had more cooling with tube radiator and under the canopy tubes to boot. There are a few working photos of these to follow.
RM.
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  #31  
Old 12-28-2012, 05:03:26 AM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Rick those are great working dimensions pictures of yours.

Enclosing my last one.
Think the pictures that i have belonged only on one place and that is in your thread.


Keep them coming.

Chris,
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:17:08 AM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Some more pictures of the ugly duckling series! Two are from the Winnipeg tractor trials showing the two sizes of tractors on their brake runs.
The third picture came from the Manitoba Agricultural Museum and is of a tractor school held at the Agricultural College in Winnipeg. Also in the picture is a single cylinder IHC and a Universal Farm Motor - the lettering only partly shows up on it and it could be the American-Abell version as they had a big warehouse in Winnipeg.
GS&M were at the Winnipeg trials in 1910 with both sizes. the 28-20 did 34.15 hp @363 rpms on the 1/2 hr max test; an average 28.13 hp @350 rpm on the 2 hr run and ploughed with a 6x12" furrow Verity (also made in Brantford).
The big tractor did 38.8 hp @335 rpms in 1/2 hr and averaged 34.86 hp @304 rpms in the 2 hr. It pulled 6x14" Cockshutt plough (also made in Brantford).
They were back in 1911 with the small tractor getting 26.2 hp @353.8 rpms in 1/2 hr and 25.15 @367.7 rpms. It pulled 4x14" Cockshutts.
The big tractor made 39.53 @280.6 rpms and 38.96 @295.3 and pulled 6x14" Cockshutt.
The trials pictures are from 1911 which was a wet, crappy year and all the companies had problems, especially with ploughing. Note they have a more "primitive" clutch arrangement at that time. They would have sounded pretty nice full out on the belt!
Oh - none of this style seems to have survived either!
RM.
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  #33  
Old 12-28-2012, 07:09:09 AM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Cooling tubes under the canopy! Could this be the invention of the hot shower?
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Old 12-28-2012, 01:44:18 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Here are some images of the mufflers on the 35-22 at the Reynolds-Alberta Museum. Other than this feature, I don't know that there is any difference between this tractor and Rick's. Sorry that the one underneath the rear cylinder is bad...but I am not a photographer.
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Old 12-28-2012, 01:57:49 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Now for the 24-12 Ideal Jr. I have attached a few shots of it. It is serial number 9964. Strangley, although the 35-22 we have and the catalogues all use the horsepower number backwards to what we are used to, this one has the numbers stamped 12-24 on the plate. There are no pictures in any of our files that show the tractor before it was restored. Kind of sad as the notes suggest it may have been in remarkable condition when Mr. Reynolds bought it in 1955. The only things that appear to be missing are the caps for the top of the exhaust pipes on the engine. When we get excited and energetic, we may see if we can figure out what they looked like and replicate them.
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:40:37 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Jim,
The overhead cooling system may have been a problem because it soon disappeared!
Randy - more to come on your tractors!
But for now, some ploughing pictures. These are not the best. The first two are from a catalogue and there is not much detail. They were just small pix in the catalogue. The last is from the Farmer's Advocate magazine and is a bit grainy but shows Winnipeg trials action!.
RM.
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Old 12-29-2012, 08:40:29 AM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Rick,

I am always very surprised about the large amount of rare very nice beautiful old pictures that you have arround you.
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Old 12-29-2012, 11:58:05 AM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Okay - the third Ideal series was built in the 35-22 (sometimes called 35-18) and the 50-25. The 35 hp model had the motor bored out to 8x10 and the bigger tractor stayed the same. Improvements were to a modern style radiator, the patented clutch (more about that later) and use of a heavy, single flywheel. It all made for a better looking tractor in my opinion. From 1912 until maybe 1916.
Both models were entered at Winnipeg in 1912 although the bigger tractor was withdrawn for reasons that are not clear - somewhere I have accounts for one year that the GS&M entry was refused because it produced more hp than allowed in that particular class - but not sure if that was the one.
The 35-22 competed against the Canadian-Heer ( 2 cyl 7x8), Avery ( 2 cyl 7.75x8), Case ( 2 cyl 7.75x8) and IHC ( 2 cyl 8x10).
In the max brake test, she developed 34.38 hp @393.5 rpms. In economy brake run - avg 33.62 hp @390.7 rpms. She ploughed with 4x14" Cockshutts. She finished in second place behind the Case - for which GS&M played up a lot for advertising.
The colourized post card picture was taken at Bow Park Farms just south of Brantford. This was eventually owned by the Cockshutt family and many of the Brantford companies used the property for testing. The farms are still there and are first class land on the flats of the Grand River. That picture is courtesy of Tim Searson.
RM.
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Old 12-29-2012, 12:15:56 PM
Randy Kvill Randy Kvill is offline
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Rick and I have been chatting as he has been working on this thread. It prompted me to post a picture of our 35-22 as it was found in 1955. The serial number on this tractor is 4159.

I believe that the front axle was found in pieces and was acquired for a pattern to make a new one or was good enough to reassemble to what is there today. The descriptions in the file suggest it had been torched apart, but I have run into things like that before and the person's description, while accurate, was actually only that some bolts may have been cut with a torch and the actual item was okay.

I do not know who the person is in this photograph. Possibly the son of the owner.

Randy
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Old 12-29-2012, 01:08:26 PM
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Default Re: Tractors By Goold, Shapley & Muir

Randy,
Here is a photo I took of your Reynolds-Alberta Museum tractor several years back - early 90s?
I can't remember who gave me the tour. I was looking through the main gallery and talked my way into the shops and storage! Maybe it was you? But this tractor sat in an outside yard away from the main property. Mr. Reynold's yard was still quite full at the time!
It is amazing that the radiator stayed with the tractor. I think the radiator for the one here came at a later date after Mr. Tysse already had the tractor - or maybe I have the story wrong! Pretty hard - expensive - unit to replace!
After being at R-AM, I chatted with the curator at the Ontario Ag Museum about possibly working a deal with you guys about getting this tractor on loan! I offered to pay the transport and do the work on it. He was generally okay with the idea but things went sour there about that time and I doub't anyone ever contacted R-AM. I had given up hope of another one ever showing up or being available!
RM
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