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Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats

1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep


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  #41  
Old 01-05-2013, 12:21:53 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

I noticed the original Purolator oil filter has been replaced with an aftermarket unit at some time in it's past life. The original has a washable element in it that resembles a heavy sock with a spring in it!! The replacement unit probably had a replaceable filter element.
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Old 01-05-2013, 05:23:26 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Tony,
Nice find! It's a nice looking survivor. I hope you have fun and post some pics when she's running again.

Corey
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  #43  
Old 01-05-2013, 11:12:54 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Here are pics of the other two transmission covers. Screw in plug is on my '28. Flip top one is on my '29.
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  #44  
Old 01-06-2013, 01:26:49 AM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Then theres the cover with the PTO unit as well, quite a large setup, really crowds the leg room. F.J.W.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:25:54 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Hey Tony, those big Allis's are always a favorite of mine and hope to have one in near future but I still have a very big soft spot for my 25-50 Baker,espacially when it on the sawmill on a long hard cut. Jim
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:54:28 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Jim, the Baker will still trump the Allis everytime! F.J.W.
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  #47  
Old 01-07-2013, 03:01:44 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Quote:
Originally Posted by FWurth View Post
Jim, the Baker will still trump the Allis everytime! F.J.W.
The Baker will trump a 20-35 Allis maybe, but it won't live with a 5 1/4" X 6 1/2" Allis EK30-60
Tricky Dickie
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  #48  
Old 01-07-2013, 09:27:49 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Sorry, Trickie but no cigar! The Baker when tested at Nebraska #161, 5.5x7 over head valve Leroi tested 43/67 HP, weight as tested 10,575 lbs. They aparently never tested the 5.250 bore Allis, The 5.0 bore Allis tested out 27x42 HP at 7200 lbs as tested. The 5.250 version was special order and the 30x60 hp is a estimate and probably pretty close. We are very fortunate to have all the above beasts in captivity here and also the Huber 40-62 here in our collection. The Baker and the Huber Have both pulled 70 HP on the dyno at the show. They also have a larger appetite than the allis but believe me as good as the allis is the Baker and Huber are considerably bigger Horses. F.J.W. PS, Both the Baker and the Huber entered the Nebraska tests with a 25-50 rating and were the most under rated tractors ever tested. the Baker was rerated to 43-67 and the Huber emerged with a rating of 40-62 and still had a healthy reserve of power left over. Also the Keck 30-60 and Monarch 75 used the same leroi motor.

Last edited by FWurth; 01-07-2013 at 11:59:27 PM.
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  #49  
Old 01-07-2013, 09:51:47 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Frank and Tricky,I have dynoed my Baker and it cranked out 80 hp. The leroi had been bored out 45 over when I got.New D9 valves and D8 guides put the engine in shape. Had to rebuild the intake and exhaust manifolds also. Very pleased with it. I'll put it up against a Allis 30-60 any day
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  #50  
Old 01-07-2013, 11:43:08 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Ok Jim, FJW, & Tricky,
that should be enough...you guys are starting a pissing match on someone elses thread about tractor preferences that are clearly in different classes.
If you are going to sound off about your 70 & 80 hp tractors, start your own thread elswhere for that.

Lets see if we can get my 20-35 tread back on track here.

I have pulled the heads off the Allis. Exhaust on #2 is not seating and the rear head has a poorly repaired water manifold hold down stud that will need to be corrected. Also the rear head has a broken off threaded exhaust flange as well as some other deterioration that will require welding repair.
Twisted off water manifold stud was removed from front head by welding on a nut and turning it out.
Last photo shows rear head. If you look close you can see broken off part of exhaust where manifold bolts on. The water manifold stud was welded into the head and I had to drill it out and make preparations for a welding repair there also.
Will post another update soon.
Tony
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  #51  
Old 01-08-2013, 02:14:37 AM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

That exhaust port is a common problem with these heads. The two in the center are the worst. They get very hot on a working tractor and their is no cooling for them as they are out of the airflow. I have had to repair a few in the past.

Also, after installing the heads it is important to install the manifolds and tighten them to the heads to make sure all the mating surfaces are in alignment before tightening down the heads as there is room for slight movement on the head studs. If this is not done, sometimes the inner exhaust gasket is not seated tightly, enough leading to exhaust leaks and erosion of the port faces.
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  #52  
Old 01-08-2013, 04:25:12 AM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Tony, As Phil has said, the centre two exhaust ports are a design fault on these engines. Those on my 20-35 were eroded away on the curvature and were too weak to repair, so we had to cut them out and make new ones from seasoned iron off an old manifold. This did the job and I guess that they are stronger than the original design which failed to take account of the very high temperature at which the centre ports run in their unventilated position when the tractor is working hard. However, care is essential when tightening the manifold to avoid that heart-stopping "ping" which tells you that something has cracked due to misalignment I think that AC probably recognised this fault and corrected it on the next series of engines, as the ports on my EK30-60 and Model A tractors are original and sound. One thing to watch out for when tightening the heads is sudden unexpected twisting off of the head studs - this happened to us with a bolt on the rear head without any warningand involved a lot of extra work removing the manifolds, rear head etc again, then drilling the stud out and replacing; the air was blue.
Frank and Jim, I bow to your superior knowledge regarding the big Baker
Tricky Dickie
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  #53  
Old 01-08-2013, 12:48:42 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Sorry Tony, no harm or match intended. On the problem of the cyl head burning thin in the exhaust ports, we had a good welder build them back up with the cast iron filler rod method, it looks like the original you can't see the repair. Spare heads are pretty hard to find any more. Seems to be the same problem on any of these large motors with multiple heads, water circulation issues in the lower corners of the head? That and the thought that these earlier ones were maybe using heavier fuel and running at higher temperatures? F.J.W.

Last edited by FWurth; 01-08-2013 at 12:58:53 PM.
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Old 01-08-2013, 09:50:30 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Sure would have been nice if they would have designed a expansion joint in the exhaust manifold like they do in todays multiple cyl. head engines so you dont hear that jaw dropping ping,followed by the other few choice words spoken when things like that happens. Tony,had some installed bigger sleeves and pistons in the engine?
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:40:55 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Thanks for all the information guys!
The last picture in post #50 shows rear head that has a broken out piece of outer left threaded bolt hole. There is a large chunk broken from outer right side (I have the missing part) and I am drilling a pilot hole where someone had welded the deteriorated water manifold stud right into the head with a stick welder
I stacked two large nuts, welded them together and set them into the one inch hole I drilled to eliminate the previous repair. On the top side I tacked a couple of washers together and ground them to fit tight in the square water manifold hole as a guide to make sure I welded the nuts in straight by threading in a long bolt. I used my Spray-transfer powder torch to nickle weld the homeade thread set into head after getting it good and hot on the wood stove. I now have a one inch deep set of 7/16 14 threads back in the head for a new water manifold holdown stud.
Yes, I know, I am a Cobble King, but it worked
More to come,
Tony
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:12:59 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

More welding,
Now that the water manifold can be installed to heads with new studs (see last post) it is time to address the deteriorated exhaust flanges.
One outer flange has just a tiny piece broken out, but the entire gasket surface is terribly erroded. There is nearly 3/16 of an inch missing all across the port gasket surface. I held a small piece of pipe in the threaded bolt hole and welded across the missing part to fill it in and then sprayed a 1/4 inch on the gasket flange to bring it up enough to mill off and be level with the rest of head.
Second photo shows studs taken out. If you work around stud directing heat into the head you can thread the stud right out perfectly preserving the bolt hole threads.
Last photo shows the larger missing chunk that came off with manifold has been nicely placed in its former home.
This Victor brand spray-transfer powder torch works wonders with strong cast iron repairs, and will weld up "dirty old cast" like exhaust manifolds very well.
See my current thread on Tractor Talk called,
"Cast Iron Grill Repair For MM Comfort Tractor" for another cast fix that shows the torch also.
Good luck on your projects everyone!
Tony
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  #57  
Old 01-09-2013, 11:25:02 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Great job Tony! Excellent welding work! I like how you repair your broken parts instead of looking for different ones. Keep it up!
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:07:50 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Those spray torches work great on old cast.I used one to rebuild the intake on my Baker 25-50.Does wonders for reairing old manifolds.Are you going to build up the exhaust manifold flanges Tony you are a master cobbler but 60 yrs ago would be considered a master mechanic.
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Old 01-10-2013, 07:40:59 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

Jim,
The spray torch has saved me a lot of money over the years!
I have fixed 40 or 50 busted up old unusual manifolds for people in the last decade. I Also have a stick welder, a comercial wirefeed and do everything myself here at home in my playpen except for engine machine work.

I do not need to fix the Allis manifold as it looks great!
Only the one head has problems and as you can see my Advanced Junior Cobblers Degree has taken care of that.
I have been late to school, late to weddings, church and now you are telling me I am 60 years to late to claim my Masters
Diploma...shoot, late again
Tony
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Old 01-10-2013, 11:01:11 PM
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Default Re: 1927 Allis 20-35 rescued from long sleep

I don't see any cobbling... Where are we supposed to look again?
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