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Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats

Working on the Hart Parr Old Reliable in Holland


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  #21  
Old 02-05-2008, 07:31:46 PM
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Craig A Craig A is offline
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Brothers Clemens.......now that you have the 30-60 Hart Parr dismantled this far it's a good time to find the serial number which is stamped in the top of the left frame rail (looking forward) near the rear of the tractor.
There should be rather large numbers stamped which are not usually visible as they are covered by the platform planks.
It would be interesting to know.......
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  #22  
Old 02-06-2008, 06:08:57 AM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Hello Marcel, Eric and Craig .
Thanks fore all the information .

First Marcel
>Originaly worked< thats a good question.
Wel i am not sure about it butt it must have been 20 to 30 years in France before that it came out Canada, Alberta,
I have heard a name Marcus Smit it was a Hart Parr collector in Veteren this must have been in the 60.
I also have heard that he past away.
My brother is going every year to the Waukee Swap in may.
I is also going this spring to Alberta to vizit a dutch farmer.
he is thinking to going to Veteren look if there is some family
of this person still exists ( maby there are some old pictures left) that would be wonderfull
I have seen a old picture that the tractor came out of Canada.
With the flywheel in one possition,that same possition it came on our farm !!!.
Some one have been trying to make it loose becouse one piston was loose.
Whe asked American friends what to do.
They say head it up butt not to fast.
So we make a big peace of long iron on the spokes of the flyweel with a rope (so we could hang on the flyweel).
Whe are afraid to make a bridge whright on it, becouse we coult crake the big engine plate ore the engine.
Make the intake, exaustcam lose so we coult not crake the valves
Then we start burning with a huge long burner.
The first day a quarter, second day half our, thirt day three quart our, fourth day one our, fifth day one our and a quarter.
Then sudenly it was loose ( wel that was a big party).
Then we have to take it out, that was a new problem.
Becouse ther was of rust behind the piston rings and if you come out of the working zone of the cylinder se was again stuk.
So we have to make a bridge and start to head it up again
At the end of the heating proces we start turn the bolds where the piston was hanging behind the bridge.
This cost us onother 5 days then the cylinder was out.
So one cylinder cost us 2 weeks.
The other cylinder the same way butt was going faster one week.
This tractor must have bean fore 80 ore 90 years stuck from standing.
I have tolkt with some old big old tractor people about it, they sey.
Most of the Big prary tractors where only used in the beginning fore maby 10 years (they where to Clumsy).
So most of the big ones are only stuck from standing.
ore disappered.
When we are going further.
We putt new pistonrings on it from Lyle.
All the valves where also stuck
It cost us one month to getting all valves out.
By heating and the compressor.
After the hole last winter working se was running in the spring.
well that was fun

Erik maby there are som people whow knows more about Carnegie have worked with a lot of tractor and engine factorys.

Craig thanks,
i have been looking fore this number butt i can find it.
The first frame rail where i am working on is the wright.
when its ready i am going to claen it up and putt it in the Owatrol (Owatrol is a special stuff fore only it keeps the rust away, you can not see it i a coopleof days enimore.and its not going blinking).
Maby if i am going to clean it up i see the number.
The other rail is next week.
I let you know when i find somthing.
Chris
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  #23  
Old 02-06-2008, 06:39:03 AM
Richard Sturdy
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

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Originally Posted by Marcel Peumans View Post
Hi Chris,
Yes, I still remember you saying you had a big H-P. If that Hart-Parr would not have a cast crankcase, I guess it would blow a 1/4"gauge plate right of with that displacement volume of 38 litres! When I was a German George's place a couple of weeks ago, and we were driving the old girl around, you could really feel the huge forces that are working inside the engine. A very interesting tractor and engine, with some nice features like the camshaft and valve operation and the forward/reverse. Where did yours originally worked?

Richard, didn't you buy a Volvo tractor in Panningen in 2004? If I remember well, you brought your Rock Island to that show.

Looking forward to meet you guys again in Bergeijk this year!

Best regards
Marcel
Yes Marcel, you are right that I bought a kerosene engined Volvo at Panningen (I have now sold it to Phillip Snowden), also I took the Rock Island and a Huber 20-36, which I have since sold, to Panningen. This year I am bringing the same Rock Island to Gijs Koolens event in August and it will be working there. Good to hear from you - I still remember standing on your big Rumely while you "walked" the flywheel round to start it!

Richard
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  #24  
Old 02-06-2008, 06:43:12 AM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

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Originally Posted by Brothers Clemens View Post
Now i know your name, thanks Richard
Today i was a litle bit further in the progress.
I took one beem out and take some pictures of it.
You can see there is a big crake in it.
I think this crake was happen more then 80 years ago.
Becouse they never weld it and they putt both sizes a little plate on it with square bolts in it.
Wat i am going to do now is welding it again, putt the little plate with square bolts agains on it so you can not see that it was welded and its stonger then.
And it stay original
When i was buzy with the frame i saw a coople time the name Carnegie .(last picture i make it al little bitt white)
I was thinking there where two big names at the begining of the 20 Century in the U.S.A.
One was Rockefeller (Oil).
The other one was Carnegie (Steel).
This frame must have been made by Carnegie Steel Company
A coople of years ago i heard a story that Popstar Madonna was been married with Guy Richie somwere in a castle in Scotland ore the U.K. that was owned by the Carnegie family
It coolt by the same family .
I have another Hart Parr 30 C and if i looked in the rear wheels, i see the same name !.
Hello Chris, I think that it is the same Carnegie family which owned the castle. There can't be many families called Carnegie who have the money to buy castles! Hope to see you at Gijs Koolens event.

Richard
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  #25  
Old 02-06-2008, 11:46:09 AM
Randy Kvill Randy Kvill is offline
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Anderson View Post
Brothers Clemens.......now that you have the 30-60 Hart Parr dismantled this far it's a good time to find the serial number which is stamped in the top of the left frame rail (looking forward) near the rear of the tractor.
There should be rather large numbers stamped which are not usually visible as they are covered by the platform planks.
It would be interesting to know.......
Just to add to this, We have also found the serial number stamped on the centre crank throw.

Randy
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  #26  
Old 02-06-2008, 12:18:17 PM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

^ Was that the engine number or the chassis number?
Never found any number at ALL on the crankshaft of the 30-60 we did here.
There is supposed to be a number stamped in the end of the crank but it was too beat up to find a trace of anything.
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Old 02-06-2008, 01:19:47 PM
Lyle S Lyle S is offline
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

The serial number could be stamped on the the middle of the crankshaft between the rod journals, it is not on all of them. I have never seen it stamped anywhere on the frame or elsewhere. There are some numbers on the frame but they are the numbers from the metal manufacture not Hart Parr.

Lyle S
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Old 02-06-2008, 01:22:04 PM
Lyle S Lyle S is offline
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

I forgot to mention this but the number on the end of the crankshaft is more than likely a part number. I have seen them stamped there.

Lyle S
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  #29  
Old 02-06-2008, 04:44:06 PM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Hallo Chris,

Ja het nederlands wordt moeilijk voor die amerikanen. Ik denk dat alleen Marcel dit kan lezen .
Ik zou graag eens langskomen. Wat denk je van komende dinsdag?? Dat zou de 12de zijn. Dan zit ik toch in Zoetermeer en heb ik geen college, dus ik kan de hele dag!!
Dan moet ik wel met het openbaar vervoer komen, maar als ik je adres heb dan lukt dat wel denk ik.

Ik hoor het wel van je Chris!!

Groeten,
Gijs
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Old 02-06-2008, 05:20:30 PM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

I just want to let you know that i can also read that
Got an Uprgrade from German George to European George

Chris i am looking forward to see your HP running beside the two otheres. Hey how cool is that to have three 30-60 a nice original a black beauty and shiny one(maybe with a pink flywheel)
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Old 02-06-2008, 05:47:04 PM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

oh yes sorry George, forgotten that you can also read this
And yes that would be great having 3 of these babes together!!
Gijs
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  #32  
Old 02-07-2008, 04:21:59 AM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Hello Richard, Randy, Craig, Lyle, Gijs and George

Richard thanks that you can identity the same Castle.

Randy Craig and Lyle
Theres al lot to do where to find the serial and fame numbers
With Rumely its sometymes also very difficult.
Somtimes you find them on front off the frame.
Somtimes on the middle poind of the Flywheel.
And with the lightweight Rumely on the frond of the castiron nose and somewere on a little plate.
If i still find somthing i let you all know.

Gijs en de koffie staat aan dinsdag klaar
Heb je mijn adres !!!.
George thanks,
Are you going to make your flywheel pink !!!

And fore all the viewers here are pictures how she was found.
Looks like the Titanic is coming out of the water.
Wel its the same year titanic was build nr.3587. 1911
you can see the dust, dirt and the spiderwebs.
Now you all understand this tractor looks lyke an old bible.
So she have to restored lyke an old bible.


I have more pictures how its arrives in Holland tommorow
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Old 02-07-2008, 12:16:53 PM
Rick McKay Rick McKay is offline
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Great work Chris!!!

Thank you for posting all of the great pic's and bringing everyone on the 'stak up to date on your progress. Very Exciting! Now I am getting the itch to get busy on my 15-27 crossmotor Case. I wish it wasn't so far to your place from here, I'd dive in and give you a hand for a few days. (And test that coffee you brag about).

Keep the photos coming!!
From Snowy Upper Michigan,
Rick McKay
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Old 02-07-2008, 01:49:41 PM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

With the Happy Farmer complete I will need to live vicariously through other people’s restoration projects. Thanks for all the updates and pictures I really enjoy looking and learning!

Randy
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Old 02-07-2008, 04:04:41 PM
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Photo Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Hello Brothers,

I think I was in the same shed as you. Looks like a farm in Seine et Marne in France.

Marc.
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Old 02-07-2008, 06:49:33 PM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle S View Post
I forgot to mention this but the number on the end of the crankshaft is more than likely a part number. I have seen them stamped there.

Lyle S
When we restored our 30-60, every nut and bolt also had the part number stamped in them. Never found the serial number anywhere but on the plate and the crank throw.

It sure made it nice to reassemble the tractor, we knew where everything went.

Randy
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Old 02-08-2008, 12:16:56 AM
Lyle S Lyle S is offline
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Randy
I have worked on a few 30-60's and some of them had the number stamped in the crankshaft but not all of them were. I have never found the serial number stamped anywhere else. You are right about the part numbers I believe every part had its number stamped on it or it had the number cast in the part.

Lyle S
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Old 02-08-2008, 04:11:42 AM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Hello Rick, Randy, Marc, Randy and Lyle .

Rick : whe like Case, we have 2 on our farm.
One L.A. whe use it somtimes to start other tractors with the beld, the other one is a Case L very nice tractor with the Eagle in the gear house.

Randy your Happy Farmer is wonderfull.
We have a very nice sulky plow of Happy Farmer, if you are interested i can show you some pictures of it.

Hello Marc, thanks fore the picture.
you dint buy it
I have a question, how many Hart Parr 30-60 dit you have in your life was it one ore two
Becouse i like to know how many of them are in Europe.
Now i am thinking there are 3 in Belgium, if you have two .
If you have only one, there are only 2 in Belgium .

Thanks Randy and Lyle fore the information.

Now i show you some more pictures
First pictures in France.
You see my brother standing next to Belgian Piet Verschelde.
With his American Mag-Lite its the same light American police cop used in car pursuit series on TV.
Whe have at the momend 3 very big heros, one in Belgium : Belgian Piet, one in America: Lyle, and one in Holland: Ronnie,
To help us with this project.

More stories and pictures to come.
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  #39  
Old 02-08-2008, 06:44:18 AM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Hallo Chris,

Lisserdijk 395 in Lisserbroek??
Dan ben ik er dinsdagochtend om een uurtje of half 11.
Het is ongeveer anderhalf uur vanuit Zoetermeer, dus goed te doen.

Tot dinsdag!!
Groeten,
Gijs
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Old 02-08-2008, 08:06:23 AM
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Default Re: Working on the Hart Parr 30-60 in Holland

Nee Gijs,
>Hillegommerdijk 49<
2165 AN Lisserbroek
Een verborgen smalle inrit tussen huisnummers 45 en 50

Tot aan dinsdag
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