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A little Briggs diagnosis needed.


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  #21  
Old 05-16-2010, 11:40:43 PM
Sean B. Sean B. is offline
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

OK, then, good job on your repair? job!!
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  #22  
Old 05-16-2010, 11:43:04 PM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

thanks but your 6 years too late.
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  #23  
Old 05-16-2010, 11:50:40 PM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

LOL!!!
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  #24  
Old 05-17-2010, 12:15:11 AM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

........
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  #25  
Old 05-17-2010, 01:52:53 PM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

Sky , after reading this thread I want to make a point. The reason the breather tube is plumbed into the air filter is to only allow clean air to enter the crank case. Under very dusty conditions dirt can enter through the breather tube. If oil is coming out the breather tube it is most likely caused by a broken ring, worn cylinder/piston etc. Has nothing to do with emissions.
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  #26  
Old 05-17-2010, 03:49:15 PM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

Due to the check valve in the breather assembly, the air should only be moving OUT of the crankcase. The theory is that this pumps all the air out to provide a slight vacuum in the crankcase to keep the oil from blowing out past the seals. Just as old cars went from having a Road Draft Tube to the PCV system, it is a form of pollution control - Sending the crankcase vapor through the carb instead of out into the atmosphere.
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  #27  
Old 05-17-2010, 05:09:26 PM
Farmboy1 Farmboy1 is offline
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

the breather tube that sky is talking about goes into the carb which sucks air in wouldn't be pumping air into the crankcase, because i too have had the exact same problem he knows what he is talking about because that will indeed fix that particular problem
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  #28  
Old 05-17-2010, 10:36:32 PM
Sean B. Sean B. is offline
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

The way John describes the operation of the breather is 100% correct, and can handle a small amount of cylinder blow by. However, when you have excess crankcase pressure, (bad rings, cylinder wall, piston) it has to go somewhere, right? It goes through the tube, forcing oil out with it into the carb. If you dont want to REPAIR the problem, you can rig it by bypassing the carb, like has been mentioned. That however, is not REPAIRING the cause, its just a band aid fix. "rigging" and "repairing" are two differant things. Both methods I have used before!
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  #29  
Old 05-17-2010, 11:03:32 PM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

It is emmisions. You can beleive what you want to i dont care. John IS 100% correct. BTW i hardly call 96 PSI bad rings and or a worn cylinder. Those engines need to BREATH. Not be choked down. You didnt see those OLD engines with that BS on there. There was no need and really there still isnt. Inless you live in california.

Last edited by Sky; 05-17-2010 at 11:13:10 PM.
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Old 05-18-2010, 08:59:26 AM
K D Redd K D Redd is offline
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

You will also get oil from the engine into the breather tube/air filter if the crankcase is not sealed correctly. The first time I noted this was after an engine rebuild on a Briggs mower engine. It had one of the EARLY dip stick system with three latches the held the dipstick in the tube. One of these latches was broken. I started the engine, the dip stick was jumping up and down and shortly the blue smoke of burning oil started. I was trying to figure out WHAT I had done wrong during the rebuild. The dip sticks jumping up and down was interfering with my thinking so I slammed it down with my hand as I was thinking. Then I noticed the blue smoke was slowly dissipating. A new dip stick cured the problem. Be sure there are NO air leaks into the crankcase.

Kent
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  #31  
Old 05-18-2010, 01:35:32 PM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

You are right John, I forgot about the check valve in the breather. I have a late 1950's briggs service bulletin that shows how to install a "surge tube" into the valve spring cover to not allow dirty air to enter the engine through the breather. This was on the very early vertical shaft engines. As for the proper diagnosis of the problem a compression test will not tell you much. A cylinder leak down test or a crankcase pressure test using a manometer are the two best ways to check a engines condition.
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  #32  
Old 05-20-2010, 10:39:54 PM
Sean B. Sean B. is offline
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

And never argue with someone who is "smarter" than the factory who built them in the first place. It really makes me wonder how all the other engines built EXACTLY like it, (millions of them) WITH the breather tube, dont have the same problem? Briggs should have allready went out of bussiness trying to fix all these emission choked engines they built under warranty. Disconnecting your breather tube to stop your oil fogging problem, is kind of like draining all your oil to stop an oil seal leak!
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  #33  
Old 05-21-2010, 10:07:37 AM
Farmboy1 Farmboy1 is offline
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

this is not a 2010 engine it is old not everything is perfect somethings develop problems and they can be fixed in various ways, could have been condensation, too much oil tons of things so there is no reason to call someone SMARTER than Briggs itself, oh and by the way briggs doesnt offer LIFETIME WARRENTIES on all of their engines if you ask me many of their designs are much poorer built than others as well leading to problems like this...
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  #34  
Old 05-21-2010, 11:03:17 AM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean B. View Post
And never argue with someone who is "smarter" than the factory who built them in the first place. It really makes me wonder how all the other engines built EXACTLY like it, (millions of them) WITH the breather tube, dont have the same problem? Briggs should have allready went out of bussiness trying to fix all these emission choked engines they built under warranty. Disconnecting your breather tube to stop your oil fogging problem, is kind of like draining all your oil to stop an oil seal leak!
I dont need your juvinile smarmy remarks. I just tryed to throw something out there in hopes giving the original poster SOME idea of what may be happening. Appears to me guys like you know it all so guys like me cant help. you are WAY out of line to comment like you have and you have NO idea who your talking too and quite frankly your beginning to piss me off.

For your information I DO NOT reccomend removing all the purge AKA emmissions tubes that you see but this one engine which was a tecumseh, had this bizzare trouble and it was a internally healthy and sound engine. This remedy CURED the problem. And no more problems continued and the engine operated under load perfectly and soundly. If there was something else wrong which there wasnt, i would have repaired it. The saying is AND YOU SHOULD KNOW THIS, you do not do any more then what is necisary to fix a customers machine. Anything else is exessive and will be costly to the customer. While there was no more problems, i could not see going into the engine further then the leak and comp. test. which was 95 PSI of comp.

For your information the older engines didnt use this "purge" tube and operated just fine without dirt getting into the engine. This is becouse they had "horsehair" or kerotine filters in them preventing as such. SO DO YOUR NEW BREATHERS.

NOW if YOU cant handle someone like me trying to help somebody in a forum without accusing me as a g*d damn "know it all" WHICH I NEVER CLAIMED TO BE, then YOUR the one who cant handle someone who has experience in engines, helping. So dont give me your smarmy grab asstic remarks about draining oil out of an engine to stop oil blow by becouse quite frankly i would look more at the rings and cylinder or first, the possibility of a clogged breather along with the rare possibility of an oil overfill.

THANK YOU from a CERTIFIED OPE tec. with 16 hard long years under his belt.

Last edited by Sky; 05-21-2010 at 11:45:53 AM.
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  #35  
Old 05-21-2010, 01:14:43 PM
Sean B. Sean B. is offline
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

Hey buddy, I am just pointing out that there is a right way and a wrong way to repair a problem.
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I dont need your juvinile smarmy remarks
Not sure what a "smarmy" remark is, and in fact I never called your name personally, you are not the only small engine guy in the world. I have seen lots of jack leg "repairs" so its not directed at you and your techumseh engine.
Quote:
you are WAY out of line to comment like you have and you have NO idea who your talking too and quite frankly your beginning to piss me off.
Once more, why the anger? This forum should be about helping guys with there equipment. Just because YOU dont like any one else disagreeing with you, is no reason to get all upset. That would be the definition of "juvenile" It seems you get real touchy about your "experience" and "years" in the bussiness, especially when someone disagrees with you. The flywheel key posts comes to mind.
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  #36  
Old 05-21-2010, 02:09:16 PM
Farmboy1 Farmboy1 is offline
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

no he's right you just want to push him because youve been thrown off your stool, one smarmy means smarty, two his repair wasnt "jack legged", and three he may not be the only small engine guy but what does that have to do with anything?
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  #37  
Old 05-21-2010, 09:07:46 PM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

I dont Jackleg crap, Sean. Im known to fix it and my work speaks for it's self. To be acused of jacklegging is a slap to my face when im a perfectionist. Yes i do get touchy but when someone try's to make me look small for a simple suggestion, wouldnt you!? Im not angered becouse someone doesnt agree with me, im angered becouse that crap keeps getting thrown in my face and i know otherwise and i have FACTS to prove it through EXPERIENCE. EXPECIALLY with that key thred. And im NOT bragging of "how many years i've been in the biz" I dont even own a business, dont care to and dont want too. Matter of fact i've recently called it quits with small engines and have moved on to stationary and automotive becouse small engines are getting rediculusly expensive these days, expecially in the antique briggs area. I just wish someone would LISTEN to me when i try to tell someone something becouse i've been there, man. If i wasnt fimiliar with it i wouldnt even respond. My intention isnt to flatter someone with the years i've done this. Im trying to tell you i have experience in that area and i know EXACTLY what im talking about. NOW, if we can just leave this thred open, free and let it be i think i can be gentlman enough to stur up the muster to shake hands with you, so to speak and call it done. You have your thoughts, i have mine.....Or we can continue to exchange comments ti'll another innocent thred gets locked up. I dont choose to but it's in your ball park.

Last edited by Sky; 05-21-2010 at 09:19:10 PM.
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  #38  
Old 05-21-2010, 10:54:32 PM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

OK guys, lets get back why this argument started. Why is the breather connected to the air cleaner. Here is a briggs service bullitin from 1955 that shows what I was talking about earlier. Even though there is a check valve in the breather dirt can still enter. That is why I think they started plumbing the crankcase into the air filter and not because of emissions. My opinion
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  #39  
Old 05-22-2010, 08:56:10 AM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

But my problem was not with an engine of this design. I have never had any trouble with an engine of that design that you picture.

Again, earlier post, simple suggestion, take it or leave it. I dont care. My intent wasnt to blow this all out of perportion. If i would have known that, i wouldnt have even said anything. Becouse of that im am done with this current thred.
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Old 05-22-2010, 10:34:43 AM
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Default Re: A little Briggs diagnosis needed.

Sky, no need to get so upset. Just read the briggs service bullitin above, it clearly shows how a breather works. The design is the same on most engines. I don't know if I am 100% right and I hope if I am not someone corrects me. It is not worth blowing a gasket. My 2 cents
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