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Magnetos, Ignition Coils and Spark Plugs Discussion about magnetos, buzz coils, spark plugs, ignitors and low tension coils.

Magnetos, Ignition Coils and Spark Plugs

1919 IHC type M help


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  #1  
Old 05-14-2017, 01:25:54 PM
Lefty and Dad Lefty and Dad is offline
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Default 1919 IHC type M help

help! i have a 1919 IHC type M with type L magneto.
I am trying to get this engine to run so we recharged the magneto (and may have more magneto questions later...)

but when I align the mark on flywheel with mark on engine (bottom), the marks on the plate on the cam will not point to the center of the mag (or mark on the mag mounting plate)

what am i missing?
I see no way to adjust this?

thanks in advanve for any help.
lefty and dad
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  #2  
Old 05-14-2017, 05:15:11 PM
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Turbo Turbo is offline
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Default Re: 1919 ihc type M help

All you need to remember is the pole of the magneto needs to break exactly when the igniter trips. I have found on IHC mags the marks on the mag are not perfect and I would go by "feel" instead of relying on the marks. First make sure the igniter trips when the mark on the flywheel is inline with the mark on the crank case. Then turn the mag in the direction of rotation and feel for the pole to break while watching the mark on the end of the shaft. Use this as a reference and time it so the pole is just breaking when the igniter trips.
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Old 05-14-2017, 10:44:32 PM
Lefty and Dad Lefty and Dad is offline
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Default Re: 1919 ihc type M help

so just ignore whether the marks on the cam plate line up with the center of the magneto axle or not ...??

---------- Post added at 10:44:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:43:10 PM ----------

and please ignore our ignorance, we're just learning!
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Old 05-15-2017, 07:37:30 AM
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Default Re: 1919 IHC type M help

Try these...Using this, I have always had good luck getting them in time and running.
Kevin
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Old 05-15-2017, 01:45:48 PM
Lefty and Dad Lefty and Dad is offline
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Default Re: 1919 IHC type M help

yes i have the diagrams.
this is where i figured out that when i aligned "A-B"...
that line "D" does not align with the "i" (magneto)
thanks!
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Old 05-15-2017, 04:25:49 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Default Re: 1919 IHC type M help

I have also found that the L mags can be installed 180 degrees out - the scribed marks are a little off center, and if you align on the 'off side, guess what - no spark! Is your engine an overshot or undershot ignitor? The overshot are a little more forgivina and are more adjautable than the undershot engines. On the undershot, it is very critical that the ignitor trips EXACTLY when the magneto is at peal magnetic flux.

For me, I took the mag off the engine and clamped it in a wood jawed vise. The power leadout wire was grounded to the case, and the mag turned by hand. In one full revolution, you will feel 2 distinct places where the armature wants to stop dead. On my 1919, the mag actually would nearly freeze when the magnetic lines peaked. When this happens, look carefully at the end of the armature, and the mag case, and see which lock point is where the scribe lines match up. You might find they dont! In that case, I would 'paint' the end of the armature with a sharpie or other indelable magic marker, and scribe your own referance line. THEN - turn your engine over until the ignitor just trips. It is at that point where the flywheel timing marks should align as per the diagram. A lot of people try to retard timing to make the engines run slower, but with an ignitor engine, this is not alwys possible, due to construction and mechanical specifications. In any case, set the engine so that the ignitor JUST trips. Install the magneto into the engine with the scribe lines aligned. If you cannot do that, then the ignitor and or cam timing need to be reviewed to make it do so. remember - with an ignitor engine, everything must be 'just so' for it to work properly.

Here are a few quick tests you can do: Turn the mag over with the power wire away from the case. It should turn without binding, and you should feel two slight areas of slight resistance to turning. There should be minimal play side to side and up and down in the bearings. When you ground the power wire to the case, you should then get 2 distinct points where the armature wants to stop turning, as stated above. If there is little change to resistance to turning between grounded and not, then either a bad coil or very weak magnets are present. When the mag is in the wood jaw vise, spin it with an electric drill, and measure the voltage with an AC voltmeter. You should get between 8 and 13 Volts. Less, then either weak coils or magnets. If voltage OK, drag the power outlet wire across a bare spot of metal on the case, while spinning with the drill. You should get a bright blue flask. If weak or no flash, bad coils or possibly oil on the armature or brush.

Have you tried running the engine on battery and coil? If it runs well, you probably have a trip timing issue - you MUST get the ignitor to trip exactly when the armature marks align. DO NOT touch the mag power wire to a battery - you will burn out the coil! The mag mounting base as well as the mag base itself, where it mounts to the engine MUST be absolutely clean bare metal. NO paint, grease or oil between the surfaces.
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Old 05-15-2017, 04:46:43 PM
tparr tparr is offline
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Default Re: 1919 IHC type M help

Maybe the crankshaft and magneto gear are not properly aligned.

---------- Post added at 04:46:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:32:25 PM ----------

cam gear not magneto gear. (correction)
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Old 05-15-2017, 06:08:47 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Default Re: 1919 IHC type M help

To double check the cam - rotate the engine BACKWARDS. The exhaust valve should JUST open at TDC. If late or early, then the cam is out of time. Turning the engine in the proper direction, the exhaust valve should open at just about 20 degrees BEFORE BDC power stroke, and JUST CLOSE at TDC between exhaust and intake strokes. The ignitor should trip about 20 degrees BTC comprerssion + or - 5 degrees. most important, on ignitor engines, the ignitor trip HAS to be timed to peak magneto magnetic flux point.
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Old 05-15-2017, 10:05:57 PM
Lefty and Dad Lefty and Dad is offline
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Default Re: 1919 IHC type M help

wow! this is alot of information.
i will sit down and study this thru, best i can, will probably be back with more questions for sure.
thanks everybody so much for your help.
if you lived within a few hours id be at your back door in the morning about daylight ! lol

---------- Post added at 10:05:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:03:17 PM ----------

i think the first thing i need to do is to make sure my gears have not somehow got outta-whack
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Old 05-17-2017, 05:46:27 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Default Re: 1919 IHC type M help

Follow directions in my last post (#*). That will tell you if the cam timing is close.
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Old 06-24-2017, 03:11:47 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Default Re: 1919 IHC type M help

L&D, get your M running yet?
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