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Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question


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  #1  
Old 08-28-2016, 05:55:38 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

My Nelson Brothers engine is 1 3/4 Hp EK mag equipped, this serial number looks very early the only date that I can see on the engine is a core plug patent dated April 8, 1913, The odd thing about this engine is that the main bearing cap on the Mag side Was cast together with governor casting all one part, is this unusual? Or is this an early style?

Your help would be most appreciated,
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Old 08-28-2016, 07:05:47 PM
Odin Odin is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

Got pictures of that?

It does sound unusual to have the main cap and governor bracket as one casting, on my T with SN 7770 the left and right main caps are identical while the governor bracket is it own casting
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Old 08-28-2016, 07:17:58 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

I will have to get back with you tomorrow the engine parts are at my shop
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Old 08-28-2016, 09:10:38 PM
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

I have T100 in my collection. It is Webster fired and has the one piece bearing cap/governor bracket. What does your mixer look like? The early ones come down and sucked the fuel off of the choke plate. I've only run into one other engine with that mixer. Most have a J bend at the bottom to be able to catch fuel even with the choke wide open. Most of these engines have the later design with the bearing cap and governor cast separately.

Last edited by Mike Monnier; 08-29-2016 at 12:39:05 PM. Reason: Spelling
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Old 08-28-2016, 09:57:49 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

That is really cool #100, and again I will get pic's tomorrow, I have another question my serial number prefix is TA yours Is T mine is a Jober brand and they have may have been built side-by-side at the factory or in lots,
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Old 08-28-2016, 11:02:17 PM
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Denis Rouleau Denis Rouleau is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnfairbanksdeere View Post
My Nelson Brothers engine is 1 3/4 Hp EK mag equipped. Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting.
Your help would be most appreciated.
I'm not a Nelson Bros. expert but serial number TA1884 seems too be much to low for a Nelson Bros. equipped with an EK magneto. The EK mags only came out in 1923 or so. Did you get the serial number off of a nametag OR from the face of the flywheel?

Denis Rouleau

Last edited by Denis Rouleau; 08-28-2016 at 11:29:34 PM.
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:38:12 PM
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

I believe the T and TA engines were built concurrently. All of the T's I've seen have a Little Jumbo tag whereas the TA's all wear a jobber tag. The T engines have a straight side hopper unlike the flared hopper on the TA. Not sure what the reason was behind that difference.
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:41:38 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnfairbanksdeere View Post
I will have to get back with you tomorrow the engine parts are at my shop
This is a picture of the complete assembly
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Old 08-29-2016, 12:50:07 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

I don't know if this is the early or the later carburetor mixer EK Mag s/n is 847697
Most likely has been replaced?

---------- Post added at 10:50:07 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:44:56 AM ----------

Photo of mixer carburetor,
I like the looks of that exhaust pushrod return spring
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Old 08-29-2016, 01:01:42 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

Trying to send another photo
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Old 08-29-2016, 02:28:15 PM
Odin Odin is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnfairbanksdeere View Post
This is a picture of the complete assembly
That looks like it would fit a Nelson T or TA, has the EK spring arm, and your mixer appears identical to the one on the T I have.

But on my engine the main bearing caps are a matched set, and the governor + camshaft bracket is a separate casting held to the base by 2 bolts.

I should have snapped some pictures of mine while it was out of the motor, since the original in my engine broke in 3 pieces after some of the bolts worked loose and the camshaft got launched. Had it re-cast years ago, and only now realize just how out of square and sloppy a fit it actually was. So I went through and squared up the base, then bored out the camshaft hole for a bushing to make it run true instead of wobbling all over, and remachined the flat for the pushrod so that it would be square to the camshaft when assembled.

But on mine that whole mess of governor camshaft and pushrod guide is held to the engine base by 2 bolts along the bottom edge, sitting in a matching pocket in the engine base.

Does yours have any additional bolts in it beyond the bearing mains? I could see a lot of engines with this design breaking it in the field if the pushrod ever jammed, it would either snap the rocker or it would snap the casting in 2 or 3 places to relieve the strain.
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Old 08-29-2016, 03:04:10 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

From what I understand this is an early design the S/N that I have is TA 1884 that was stamped in the flywheel the later models have separate caps,
The only support for the complete mechanism are the two main cap bolts and push rod resting in the head,
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Old 08-29-2016, 03:15:37 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

Also another odd thing about this engine it has an output gear on the crankshaft that may have attached two who knows what any help would be appreciated,
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Old 08-29-2016, 09:25:14 PM
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

I've seen a couple of Nelson Brothers engines mounted on carts with mud pumps. I suspect that your engine was likely set up with a gear driven pump of some kind.

Your mixer is the later "improved" design. I will have to search for pictures of my engine and post a link so you can see the difference. I've only seen one other engine like mine and it was serial number T113.

I had one of the bearing cap studs work loose from the base while running at a show. I happened to be behind the engine and noticed the governor jumping each time it fired. I remember seeing one of these assemblies at a swap meet that was snapped like Odin described.
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Old 08-29-2016, 09:30:18 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

I will have to remember that when I complete this engine, this will be my next project probably in about 6 months,
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Old 08-31-2016, 09:22:01 PM
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

I found this picture of T100 on my cell phone. I took this on its first run in the driveway in 2015. You can see how the mixer comes straight down without an elbow at the bottom. The stripes were patterned after the ones on my Wico engine that has a bunch of original paint.
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Old 09-01-2016, 02:21:32 PM
SteveFromTexas SteveFromTexas is offline
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Default Re: Nelson Brothers built model TA s/n 1884 Casting Question

That is a nice-looking engine,
I have Highhope's for mine it's not going to need many repairs, I think that will stick with the EK mag only because that's how I found it,
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