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Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos


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  #1  
Old 07-11-2017, 11:38:11 AM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
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Default Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

Been told its a HB, whats that mean? I don't know diddley bout cummins but I like it. I think its a power unit orignally used on a machinery, not truck? Its got block casting date 2-14-45. Please comment with any info u can, looking 2 learn. As shown weighs 3700 lbs. thanks 4 looking.






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Old 07-11-2017, 03:11:52 PM
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Ed Noli Ed Noli is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new 2 me, maybe early 1945, photos

Some info I have. Must have been upgraded to the newer style pump at some point in its life.
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Old 07-11-2017, 06:01:10 PM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new 2 me, maybe early 1945, photos

yes its has, its a good thing i've read so far.
serial number is 51210 or C instead of 0. thanks 4 looking.

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Old 07-11-2017, 11:06:25 PM
dieselsteveo dieselsteveo is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new 2 me, maybe early 1945, photos

That a great looking engine. Is it the same one that was for sale on EnginAds 1-2months ago? Looks similar....

Anyways, serial # 51210 would've been build in the first few weeks of July 1945. I will look to see if we have the build records for it. It is a Model H, and as Ed mentioned, your engine would've been built with the Single Disc fuel pump, and has been upgraded to the PT fuel system which came out in 1954. This is a very common upgrade and I'm sure you'll enjoy it more with PT. As far as the B in the HB name, I'm spacing out on what it stands for. We had HA's, HB's, HMR's, and then when we added super-charging and other configs the names got even longer and a bit out-of-control Sometimes the second letter refers to the application (eg: HMR's are marine), but HB's were used in both auto and industrial so B doesn't equal application.

It appears your engine has an air compressor in front of the fuel pump?? Am I seeing that correctly? The skid is also atypical with that large arch on the manifold side. If I had to guess, this unit was probably in a construction application (eg: shovel, crane, etc). Hopefully the build records will shine light on this.

We have full sets of manuals for this engine, so if you ever need any info, let me know. I can't/won't scan the whole manual for you - but happy to scan sections.

Cheers,
Steve
Cummins Historical Team Lead
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Old 07-12-2017, 02:49:33 AM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new 2 me, maybe early 1945, photos

Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselsteveo View Post
That a great looking engine. Is it the same one that was for sale on EnginAds 1-2months ago? Looks similar….

***yes bought it from the ads, thanks harry!


Anyways, serial # 51210 would've been build in the first few weeks of July 1945. I will look to see if we have the build records for it. It is a Model H, and as Ed mentioned, your engine would've been built with the Single Disc fuel pump, and has been upgraded to the PT fuel system which came out in 1954. This is a very common upgrade and I'm sure you'll enjoy it more with PT. As far as the B in the HB name, I'm spacing out on what it stands for. We had HA's, HB's, HMR's, and then when we added super-charging and other configs the names got even longer and a bit out-of-control Sometimes the second letter refers to the application (eg: HMR's are marine), but HB's were used in both auto and industrial so B doesn't equal application.

It appears your engine has an air compressor in front of the fuel pump?? Am I seeing that correctly?

****i forgot what zack said about it. its at my sons shop, i'll get better pics soon.

The skid is also atypical with that large arch on the manifold side. If I had to guess, this unit was probably in a construction application (eg: shovel, crane, etc). Hopefully the build records will shine light on this.

***** it looks 2 me the skid was torch cut from the original equipment frame structure that held the unit. I agree shovel, crane, etc.

We have full sets of manuals for this engine, so if you ever need any info, let me know. I can't/won't scan the whole manual for you - but happy to scan sections.

*****thank u, waiting 4 what build record may indicate. I'll be fixing it up, detailing it cherry along with replacing missing hood and side covers. it'll be 4 show, maybe sawmill or rockchrusher work at our local show.

Cheers,
Steve
Cummins Historical Team Lead
********mike
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Old 07-12-2017, 07:41:24 AM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new 2 me, maybe early 1945, photos

How difficult would it be 2 find a oil pan for this? i'm going to drop it to disludge it. Its been busted and brazed up big time, but not leaking. Would new pan gaskets be available?
thank u
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Old 07-12-2017, 10:12:33 AM
ronm ronm is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

That is a nice engine. Good you were able to save it...
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Old 07-12-2017, 03:57:20 PM
dieselsteveo dieselsteveo is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

I was close. Your engine was built July 6, 1945, tested July 7, 1945, and shipped to "Diesel Sales Company of Wisconsin" on July 18, 1945. It is listed as a "PD" application, which is a power unit, probably for drilling oil/gas. I found some photos that show other power units, all being using for oil/gas applications. They show the hood, the louvered side covers, the fuel tank that was mounted where your air cleaner currently is...and a few of the photos show engine mounted on the same skid/rails that yours is mounted on. Your engine was not built with an air compressor, so whatever is in front of your fuel pump was added later on.

The build record and photo files are bigger than what the forum will allow me to upload so I've uploaded them here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6...WtJaXJnMGpaV00
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Old 07-12-2017, 05:45:08 PM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

So its a "HPD-600"? What does revision "B" mean on the spec sheet? I'm surprised the skid may be original as its rather crudely torched to size. Dingleberries/slag not scraped off. Not complaining i'm happy with how complete it is. Not much gas/oil in wisconsin but a lot of water with channel cleaning required, stone and sand quarries needing power. maybe a pump power unit of some type.

Arched cutout in skid may be 4 a oil drain pan?


thank u.

p.s. i just now scrolled up enough to see second build sheet page.i'll have to see if serial numbers match on the starter, generator and pto.

thanks again.

Last edited by mschreiber; 07-12-2017 at 06:31:09 PM.
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Old 07-12-2017, 08:57:33 PM
halcon halcon is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

Most of the larger cranes and shovels had air assisted controls. That could explain the compressor.
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Old 07-12-2017, 11:26:28 PM
dieselsteveo dieselsteveo is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

I agree the large arch cutout on the frame is not Cummins original and was done for whatever reason (access to oil, interference with something on the application, etc) by a previous owner.

I'm working on what revision B means. I know we updated the Model H design over time (e.g.: the very earliest H's still had Babbitt bearings), so I'm sure it has to do with that. Not sure what all was changed for revB

In regards to the oil pan, will be hard, but probably not impossible to find. You will need to find another engine as a source of parts or connect with people who have engines to part out. My current connections have automotive H's, so not the same pan as your engine. As far as the gasket, you could get a sheet of cork and cut it out yourself if you want for pretty cheap. If you'd prefer to buy one, let me know and I'll find one for you.
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Old 07-13-2017, 12:16:08 PM
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

Revision 'B' of the Model H happened in 1935. It included larger crankshaft journal diameters, modern replaceable bearing shells, and an increase in rated HP from 125HP to 150HP
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:09:19 PM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

2 me the cut out arch with welded flat looks the most professional part of the skid. The skid channel is 15" tall with the front and rear cross members being 3" off the deck, not much clarence to get anything under it. Sooo the auto and pd unit oil pans are different… even being "h" models? thanks 4 ur help.

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Most of the larger cranes and shovels had air assisted controls. That could explain the compressor.
better than air brake compressor to stop the BUS when i wanna get off.
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Old 07-13-2017, 10:47:07 PM
moteurdelco moteurdelco is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

i think than a NH220 or H 180 PAN will bolt on your engine.
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Old 07-14-2017, 12:18:56 AM
dieselsteveo dieselsteveo is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

To clarify, the H (like all our engines) had a number of different oil pan options. ALL of them bolt to the same block and thus have the same bolt pattern. The differences are:
--location of the oil pickup/suction
--built-in oil filter or external
--capacity

Technically any H oil pan you get will fit on your engine, but some may take a few more tweaks/mods than others to function. Your engine was built with a oil filter in the pan. If you were to get an oil pan without the built-in filter, then you should add an external oil filter. Get the idea?
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Old 07-30-2017, 11:41:17 AM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

Some photos and questions. It appears to be bendix-westinghouse compressor. But what is the b-w thingy the pen is pointing out? Was it part of the PT fuel system update? What is a PT fuel system? and what does pt mean? thanks 4 any help.







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Old 07-30-2017, 01:36:46 PM
The Diesel Doctor The Diesel Doctor is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

IT says Bendix Westinghouse on the cover plate and the lines appear to go to the air compressor. It could be an early type of air pressure regulator. AL
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Old 07-30-2017, 09:35:19 PM
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

Hey Mike! This is Mike from NJ.
Really nice engine you got there!
PT stands for "Pressure-Time"
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Old 08-01-2017, 12:51:47 PM
Sooty Jim Sooty Jim is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

Here are some specs and pics from 1944 and assuming this engine actually does date from that era, it would be an "H," right, not an HB, which shows up in my '56 book. This spec chart appears to list everything from that era.

I also included a pic of the H-600 and the HS-600, which was supercharged and made 200 hp.

My '56 book ale shows an HRB-600 which had a 5-1/8" bore vs the 4-7/8" on the HB-600.



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Old 08-09-2017, 09:27:46 PM
moteurdelco moteurdelco is offline
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Default Re: Cummins HB new to me, maybe early 1945, photos

I think ;h,hb,hr,hrs-600 are all 4''7/8;so 600 cubic inches.
5 1/8'' cyl. were named H,HB,HR,HRS,NHetc-743, some with 2 valves/cylinder and others 4 valves/cyl.
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